Do Not make a company aware of their non-compliant signs!

[Javier730]

[The Annoyed Man]

A search of this forum will find numerous posts where a well-intended member, speaking out of conviction in favor of the 2nd Amendment, has felt the need to inform a business owner that his signs were meaningless to a CHL. The most vocal of them even feel the need to inform the business owner exactly what kind of sign is needed to keep a CHL out.

Let me state very clearly:

• THAT IS JUST DUMBER THAN A BAG OF HAMMERS!!!!

If you see an invalid sign, just smile and walk on past it. Do NOT screw things up for the rest of us by giving voice to some need to smugly inform the uninformed of how ignorant they are.........and then proceed to TEACH them the right way to do it. Just smile and walk on by.

Here's the deal......... ANYTHING you do or don't do as a CHL has consequences for all other CHLs.......INCLUDING the actual use of your firearm in self-defense. We are on an arc toward greater gun-rights freedom in Texas, but if you mess something up, you can set things back for at least some of us. It may not be fair, but it is true. When MLK led the civil rights movement, he called for, AND EXPECTED, a higher level of sobriety and wisdom of behavior from his acolytes. His movement absolutely depended on moral authority, and it is nearly impossible to convince people that you stand on the moral high ground unless you give them a reason to believe it in how you act. It may be unfair to be held to a higher standard, but perception counts for a lot with uninformed people, and how they perceive YOU may have a strong influence on how they perceive gun rights.

In that light, what does it tell a business owner who has posted an invalid sign when you come strutting up and tell him his sign has no bearing on YOU?

1. It tells him/her "I have a gun, and you can't stop me........on your own property".
2. It tells him/her "You were too stupid to do your research."
3. It tells him/her "Here's what you have to do to get rid of me."

Answer honestly..... you are that business owner who does not want guns in his/her business, and someone walks up to you and drops those three dimes on you...... How are YOU going to react? The honest answer is the obvious answer:

• "I'm going to research the definition of a 'compliant' sign, and then I'm going to post a compliant sign. Secondarily, at my next networking/Chamber meeting, I'm going to share this information I've learned with all the other business owners whom I call "friend" (because we share the same views), so that THEY can all post THEIR businesses with a compliant sign."

Don't do it!

[Abraham]

I just returned home from running errands.

One errand found me in a business that had a sign in an 8 X 10 photo frame declaring the business of off limits for guns even for CHL holders. It even referenced per 30.06, in passing, that no guns were allowed in their business, but didn't have the proper 30.06 anywhere and I checked. It went on further to say words to the effect that customers and employees alike would be subject to being searched. If anyone refused to being searched, if an employee they would be dismissed and a customer denied service.

The above is no where near verbatim, I've paraphrased best I can recall.

I had my Glock 19 on my belt, appendix carried, inside my black, leather, zippered rectangular pack. It's kinda large and not to be overlooked if you happen to look at me head on.

I was in this business waiting for a particular service for at least 45 minutes and nary a word was said or any significant notice taken by the various business workers and/or management staff.

Of course, I didn't say their tiny notice/sign was ridiculous or how to make it right.

No way...

[Abraham]

I forget to mention, their itty bitty notice was placed in an obscure area on a shelf in an open book case of sorts.

Because I'm restless when waiting for service and can't sit still in the various waiting rooms, I walked all over the waiting room.

I spotted their silly notice only because I walked and looked at everything there was to look at while killing time.

The average person would never see their non-compliant signage, if it could even be called that.

[Kiddkop]

This is my 1st post and I am not even a card carrying member yet, still waiting on DPS to do their thing. But, I do work in the field of CJ and was previously a Peace Officer.

I don't understand the point of this post. Most people that are CHL don't frequent business' that properly post 30.06; therefore, why would a person want to carry in a business that does not want their business? Regardless of if the posting is accurate, the intent is the owner does not want a patron with a weapon.

I don't think that I would voluntarily tell a business owner that the sign in not in compliance, but I don't think I will continue to shop in a business that does not want me.

[rotor]

I just returned home from running errands.

One errand found me in a business that had a sign in an 8 X 10 photo frame declaring the business of off limits for guns even for CHL holders. It even referenced per 30.06, in passing, that no guns were allowed in their business, but didn't have the proper 30.06 anywhere and I checked. It went on further to say words to the effect that customers and employees alike would be subject to being searched. If anyone refused to being searched, if an employee they would be dismissed and a customer denied service.

The above is no where near verbatim, I've paraphrased best I can recall.

I had my Glock 19 on my belt, appendix carried, inside my black, leather, zippered rectangular pack. It's kinda large and not to be overlooked if you happen to look at me head on.

I was in this business waiting for a particular service for at least 45 minutes and nary a word was said or any significant notice taken by the various business workers and/or management staff.

Of course, I didn't say their tiny notice/sign was ridiculous or how to make it right.

No way...

You actually stayed in a store that posted that they had the right to search you?

[Abraham]

Rotor,

Yes, I did.

Had they attempted to search me, I would've laughed heartily and told them no, I would not submit to a search. As was plainly obvious though, they weren't looking to keep gun toting customers out of the store. My rather massive gun pack would raised a lot of suspicion if they were rabidly anti-gun. As it was, my gun pack seemed invisible for all the non-interest it created.

As to not doing business with businesses that post non-compliant signs that say "no guns" I assume they don't really mean it, or they'd post proper 30.06 signage.

If they do mean it, but are not up to par on what they need to do to make it enforceable, all I can do is laugh and carry...

I do think some businesses post non-compliant signs in order to keep the frightened/antis anxiety down...full well knowing CHLers can come in without a problem.

[Abraham]

Kiddkop,

O.K., but many businesses post non-compliant signs (in my opinion) to keep the hand wringing, knuckle biter anti-gun types from going bonkers with worry, all the while knowing CHLers will legally come in.

If, you feel terribly upset that non-compliant signs offend you to the max, well sure, don't do business with them.

Me, I'm going to do business with them as there are a huge number of non-compliant signs posted and I'm not going to avoid doing business with them or my choices will be very, very limited.

[EEllis]

While I wouldn't bring a non compliant sign to the attention of a business to scoff about how they got it wrong or to correct them I disagree that there is something wrong with bringing a non compliant sign up with a business.
if someone is truly anti then I want to know to be able to decide how I spend my money. I can't do that if I don't know if posting an unenforceable sign is intentional or not. That is just one reason I could see possibly approaching a business. There are others. We each make our own choices you will not make mine for me. And no one else should feel pressured by people on here about their choice either.

[Kiddkop]

@abraham

I disagree....but I really don't know that I care.
If a person doesn't do business at a place that has a proper 30.06 posting, it would stand to reason that person would not want to do business at a place that has an Improper posting.

I think most people except CHLers believe that a gun buster sign means that guns are not allowed, including the business owner.

[Taypo]

@abraham

I disagree....but I really don't know that I care.
If a person doesn't do business at a place that has a proper 30.06 posting, it would stand to reason that person would not want to do business at a place that has an Improper posting.

I think most people except CHLers believe that a gun buster sign means that guns are not allowed, including the business owner.

And do you think that there's a point to a business owner posting a non-compliant sign? Perhaps to give those who don't know better a warm fuzzy and allow those of us who do to go about our business?

[Kiddkop]

Well, I disagree. Their ignorance should not be used by a CHLer to circumvent the intent. This is probably the reason the Anti-crowd has the opinion they do of the Pro-2nd Crowd.

I was legally authorized to carry for about 8 yrs and rarely did so. I have legally carried concealed in my vehicle for yrs. but, as a future CHLer, I will either not do business in a place if I choose not to based on their stance or I will secure my weapon in the vehicle and not carry on their property if they show the "intent" they do not want my weapon present.

Searching for technical violations is a problem, not a solution to a problem.

Everyone has an opinion, and that is mine.