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Government Admits Weapons Aren't coming from US

Posted: Tue Apr 14, 2009 2:47 pm
by frazzled
http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id ... _article=1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

My bold-hidden in middle
MEXICO CITY (AP) - A woman was arrested guarding an arsenal that included an anti-aircraft machine gun—the first weapon of its kind seized in Mexico, police said Tuesday.
The arsenal belonged to a group linked to the powerful Beltran Leyva drug cartel, federal police coordinator Gen. Rodolfo Cruz said. It also included ammunition, five rifles, a grenade and part of a grenade launcher.

Mexican drug cartels, battling a fierce crackdown by soldiers and federal police, have increasingly gotten hold of higher-powered weapons, even military-grade arms such as grenades and machine guns. That has left police—particularly state and municipal forces—grossly outgunned, and many officers have quit following attacks.


Cruz said the confiscated .50-caliber, anti-aircraft machine gun can fire 800 rounds per minute and is capable of penetrating armor from more than 5,000 feet (1,500 meters). Police on a routine patrol Monday found the gun fitted atop an SUV at a house in northern Sonora state.

Authorities did not release any other details about the gun, including its make, where it was manufactured, or where it was sold.

The arrested suspect, Anahi Beltran Cabrera, apparently is not related to the Beltran Leyva clan, Cruz said.

The U.S. Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives has traced many guns seized at scenes of drug violence in Mexico to U.S. commercial sources. But determining the source of military-grade weapons such as grenades and fully automatic machine guns is more complicated.

The ATF says the grenades are mostly smuggled in through Central America, and have been traced back to the militaries of many countries, from South Korea to Spain and Israel. Some may be leftovers from the Central American civil wars.


Assailants have fired on government aircraft performing anti-drug missions in Mexico in the past, but apparently never with the caliber of weapon found Monday.

In 2006, a helicopter on a federal drug-eradication mission crashed while trying to escape ground fire, and a second helicopter was damaged by gunfire in the Pacific coast state of Guerrero.

Mexico is upgrading its northern and southern border checkpoints in an effort to detect and seize more guns and other contraband, installing equipment that will weigh and photograph each car and truck coming into the country.

President Barack Obama has promised to do more to stop gun trafficking from the United States to Mexico. He has pledged to dispatch nearly 500 more federal agents to the border, along with X-ray machines and drug-sniffing dogs.

Mexico's drug violence has claimed more than 10,650 lives since President Felipe Calderon launched a military-led offensive against trafficking cartels in December 2006.

In March, the government sent thousands more troops to the northern border to quell escalating violence. The government announced Sunday that drug-related homicides fell 26 percent across the country in the first three months of the year, compared to the same period in 2008.

Re: Government Admits Weapons Aren't coming from US

Posted: Tue Apr 14, 2009 2:54 pm
by Purplehood
I read that and didn't see any admission that weapons are not coming from the US. What did I overlook? Or are you deducing/inferring this from the decision of the Mexican government to tighten its central-American borders?

Re: Government Admits Weapons Aren't coming from US

Posted: Tue Apr 14, 2009 3:24 pm
by frazzled
You're right, its more of an admission that there are weapons and munitions not coming from the US. Its a start.

Re: Government Admits Weapons Aren't coming from US

Posted: Tue Apr 14, 2009 4:26 pm
by stroo
It is certainly an admission that some weapons are coming from the US particularly grenades and military-grade weapons.

Re: Government Admits Weapons Aren't coming from US

Posted: Tue Apr 14, 2009 7:48 pm
by zeropistons
Of note, the prominently pictured weapon that they seized isn't a .50 cal machine gun. It's an M1919. I guess calling it a 30.06 (or 7.62x51, or whatever) machine gun just doesn't make the news like .50 cal antiaircraft machine gun.

Re: Government Admits Weapons Aren't coming from US

Posted: Tue Apr 14, 2009 8:31 pm
by Lodge2004
zeropistons wrote:Of note, the prominently pictured weapon that they seized isn't a .50 cal machine gun. It's an M1919. I guess calling it a 30.06 (or 7.62x51, or whatever) machine gun just doesn't make the news like .50 cal antiaircraft machine gun.
I was trying to figure that out myself. The cartridges looked way too small for .50 cal. My first guess was the coaxial gun on a tank, but after looking it up, I see that it was definitely the M1919. In any case, it's NOT an anti-aircraft machine gun or a .50 cal. Then again, I'd hate for facts to get in the way of a good story line.

Re: Government Admits Weapons Aren't coming from US

Posted: Tue Apr 14, 2009 8:54 pm
by zeropistons
This photo was released a few hours later with pretty much the same article:

http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/sl ... QQ?index=0



OK, that's a .50. I don't know if the photo really is from the same incident, because the original story didn't mention finding two machine guns; which it surely would have.

Re: Government Admits Weapons Aren't coming from US

Posted: Tue Apr 14, 2009 9:07 pm
by Lodge2004
Here is the other machine gun. Now I wonder if there were more than one, or if they realized their error and then went out and got a different one to match their press release. Seems silly to mount a .50 cal like that on a pickup...would probably draw some attention.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldne ... t-gun.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Re: Government Admits Weapons Aren't coming from US

Posted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 1:18 am
by KD5NRH
Lodge2004 wrote:I was trying to figure that out myself. The cartridges looked way too small for .50 cal. My first guess was the coaxial gun on a tank, but after looking it up, I see that it was definitely the M1919. In any case, it's NOT an anti-aircraft machine gun or a .50 cal. Then again, I'd hate for facts to get in the way of a good story line.
Considering the tripod style, one would have to be above the aircraft to use it for that.

Re: Government Admits Weapons Aren't coming from US

Posted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 8:10 am
by llanite
Breitbart and Google might not have put this on bad actors in the US, but the Houston Comical links the discovery of the weapon directly to this result:
Federal agents are planning to blitz Houston and the southern half of Texas...
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/front/6374078.html

I guess it's clear which side the Houston media falls on in the debate....

Re: Government Admits Weapons Aren't coming from US

Posted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 9:16 am
by Mithras61
llanite wrote:Breitbart and Google might not have put this on bad actors in the US, but the Houston Comical links the discovery of the weapon directly to this result:
Federal agents are planning to blitz Houston and the southern half of Texas...
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/front/6374078.html

I guess it's clear which side the Houston media falls on in the debate....
I sort of liked this part:
Gun’s source unknown

Mike Vigil, the Drug Enforcement Administration’s former chief of international operations, said the weapon is capable of “a massacre … they were probably waiting for a major offensive.”

Vigil suspected the weapon belonged to the Mexican military, but was obtained by corrupting military officers.

The issue of U.S.-made weapons ending up in the hands of cartels has gained attention in recent months and is expected to be part of the discussion between Obama and Calderon.

Mexican government officials have said repeatedly that if the U.S. government wants them to curb the northward flow of drugs, America will have to curb the southward flow of weapons.

Sounds to me like we need to stop selling guns to the Mexican government... :mrgreen:

Re: Government Admits Weapons Aren't coming from US

Posted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 9:45 pm
by zeropistons
I looked around a little bit. Please keep in mind that I looked around a lot last night and didn't find this photo.


From: http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/sh ... p?t=155342

Image
Image

Now, how can you talk about a machine gun and not show pictures of it? I'm not saying that I don't trust the press or the Mexican government not to sensationalize things. OK, I am. Really. Support your stories with appropriate photos. It's a rule to live by whether you're a mall ninja or a media outlet.