Utah Problem - SOLVED

[The Mad Moderate]

The first is the Privileges and Immunities clause, Article IV, Section 2, Clause 1, of the original Constitution. It says, "The Citizens of each State shall be entitled to all Privileges and Immunities of Citizens in the several States."

Thats what I was thinking of, its unfortunate we don't have nationwide rescproscity which would make this an (almost) moot point.

[seamusTX]

I agree that it's unfortunate, but it is a fact.

It took most of the 20th century to get uniform driver license regulations. With some states not having concealed carry at all, some making it nearly impossible, and others like Texas, Utah, and Florida being somewhat free, it's going to be a looooong time before there is any kind of universal recognition.

- Jim

[apostate]

I once asked the guy from KC Precision ammo (a commercial maker of custom ammo) at the Ft Worth show if he carried product liability insurance. He wasn't offended, and my question wasn't intended to offend. He answered the question, and I was satisfied.

That's wonderful. You asked a factual question and got a factual answer. By contrast, Heritage1 asked questions like "Doesn’t it bother you..." and "don’t you think it’s unfair..." which are about feelings, not facts. Had he asked fact-based questions he might have gotten fact-based answers. Instead, he asked emotion-based questions so it's not really surprising to me if they elicited an emotion-based response.

[jmra]

Sure they do. Plenty of defunct businesses treated their potential customers like an annoyance until the customers went elsewhere.

What's that cliché about an armed society being a polite society? I don't think so. Not in this case.

- Jim

These guys are not going out of business because they ticked off potential customers. They are going out of business because they ticked off government officials.

[fickman]

So you have to have a license in your home state before you can get a non-resident CFP from Utah.

What happens if your home state license expires before the Utah license expires? Is the Utah license only recognized during the time that your home license is active, or does your home license only have to be renewed in time to renew the Utah license?

(Essentially, a lot of people were using the Utah license to stagger expiration dates and provide coverage for them during their Texas renewals due to the occasional long processing times. . . in case their Texas CHL lapsed for a few days / weeks / months.)

Can this still happen, or does the Utah CFP become void as soon as your home license expires?

[Bullwhip]

1.) Doesn’t it bother you that you're giving a license to carry to someone that you don’t even know that they can shoot?
1.a.) In that respect how does the Utah class cover the third person liability laws and civil liability here in Texas?
2.) I'm a Dad that pays child support, don’t you think it’s unfair to neglected kids that someone behind on child support can pay for a gun and out of state CHL but not pay their child support?
2.a.) Same scenario as #2 but in regards to their taxes.

Does it bother YOU that residents of those other states with those licenses can carry in Texas? Texas CHL is good in about 35 states i think, how many tests have you passed for those states about their laws?

[stash]

Are there really Florida instructors instructing in the state of Texas?

[Bulldog1911]

I for one and glad this passed. I took my class(Texas CHL-100) in March along with my dad and a couple friends. I had several other family members that were planning on taking the class with us, but then my "brilliant" cousin found out that he could take the easy way out(and cheaper) and get a Utah license. He convinced his dad and the other family members that were going to take the class with us to do the same. I tried repeatedly to convince them that it was a stupid idea. What if Texas decides to not honor non-resident permits? Then you'll have to do it the right way and it will cost you more money in the long run. Of coarse he didn't listen.

When their "Utah instructor" came, he gave them the option of getting a Utah or Florida license. They opted for Florida. Does anyone know if Florida is contemplating a similar bill?

[ScottDLS]

I for one and glad this passed. I took my class(Texas CHL-100) in March along with my dad and a couple friends. I had several other family members that were planning on taking the class with us, but then my "brilliant" cousin found out that he could take the easy way out(and cheaper) and get a Utah license. He convinced his dad and the other family members that were going to take the class with us to do the same. I tried repeatedly to convince them that it was a stupid idea. What if Texas decides to not honor non-resident permits? Then you'll have to do it the right way and it will cost you more money in the long run. Of coarse he didn't listen.

When their "Utah instructor" came, he gave them the option of getting a Utah or Florida license. They opted for Florida. Does anyone know if Florida is contemplating a similar bill?

Florida is pretty expensive, and ironically they don't recognize non-res licenses from other states. They also require you to shoot. I doubt the Florida option saved them much money. The fee $117.00. I had one for a few years. It came in handy when my Texas CHL expired before DPS got around to processing my renewal. Now I have an AZ that I would use.

[Bulldog1911]

I for one and glad this passed. I took my class(Texas CHL-100) in March along with my dad and a couple friends. I had several other family members that were planning on taking the class with us, but then my "brilliant" cousin found out that he could take the easy way out(and cheaper) and get a Utah license. He convinced his dad and the other family members that were going to take the class with us to do the same. I tried repeatedly to convince them that it was a stupid idea. What if Texas decides to not honor non-resident permits? Then you'll have to do it the right way and it will cost you more money in the long run. Of coarse he didn't listen.

When their "Utah instructor" came, he gave them the option of getting a Utah or Florida license. They opted for Florida. Does anyone know if Florida is contemplating a similar bill?

Florida is pretty expensive, and ironically they don't recognize non-res licenses from other states. They also require you to shoot. I doubt the Florida option saved them much money. The fee $117.00. I had one for a few years. It came in handy when my Texas CHL expired before DPS got around to processing my renewal. Now I have an AZ that I would use.

Interesting, they didn't have to shoot!!!!

[Bulldog1911]

I doubt the Florida option saved them much money.

Interesting, they didn't have to shoot!!!!

Also, you're right about that. It was only $20.00 more for me to get texas CHL. After I did the math for him, his rebuttal was the time in class. Their class was only 4 hours long, and they weren't required to shoot...absurd!

[Hoosier Daddy]

What happens if your home state license expires before the Utah license expires? Is the Utah license only recognized during the time that your home license is active, or does your home license only have to be renewed in time to renew the Utah license?

The new Utah law requires applicants to have a home state license (with some exceptions) in order to issue a new or renewal Utah license. During the term of the Utah CFP, it is not contingent on your home state license remaining valid. So, the way the law is written, you can still use a Utah CFP for gap coverage.

[Keith B]

I doubt the Florida option saved them much money.

Interesting, they didn't have to shoot!!!!

Also, you're right about that. It was only $20.00 more for me to get texas CHL. After I did the math for him, his rebuttal was the time in class. Their class was only 4 hours long, and they weren't required to shoot...absurd!

Florida law does not say you must prove proficiency, just competency with a firearm (not even a handgun) via an approved method. An NRA Hunter Safety course is acceptable, and they don't require you to shoot.

Florida law requires you to submit proof of competency with a firearm in order to qualify for a concealed weapon license. A
copy of a CERTIFICATE OF COMPLETION or similar document from any of the following courses or classes is acceptable:
 any hunter education or hunter safety course approved by the Florida Fish and Wildlife Conservation Commission or
a similar agency in another state;
 any National Rifle Association firearms safety or training course;
 any firearm safety or training course or class available to the general public offered by a law enforcement agency,
junior college, college, or private or public institution or organization or firearms training school, utilizing instructors
certified by the National Rifle Association, the Criminal Justice Standards and Training Commission, or the
Department of Agriculture and Consumer Services;
 any law enforcement firearms safety or training course or class offered for security guards, investigators, special
deputies, or any division or subdivision of law enforcement or security enforcement;
 any firearms training or safety course or class conducted by a state-certified instructor or by an instructor certified by
the National Rifle Association.
The copy of the training certificate/document must be clear and legible. The certificate/document must include your name, the
instructor's name, the instructor's signature, and the instructor's certification number.
Other acceptable forms of training documentation include the following:
 documentary evidence of experience with a firearm obtained through participation in organized shooting competition;
 active-duty military personnel may submit copies of any of the following documents that confirm your experience with a
firearm gained during your service: military orders including call to active-duty letter; a statement of military service signed
by, or at the direction of, the adjutant, personnel officer, or commander of your unit or higher headquarters which identifies
you and provides your date of entry on your current active-duty period;
 former military personnel can submit a DD Form 214 reflecting honorable discharge from military service.

[fickman]

What happens if your home state license expires before the Utah license expires? Is the Utah license only recognized during the time that your home license is active, or does your home license only have to be renewed in time to renew the Utah license?

The new Utah law requires applicants to have a home state license (with some exceptions) in order to issue a new or renewal Utah license. During the term of the Utah CFP, it is not contingent on your home state license remaining valid. So, the way the law is written, you can still use a Utah CFP for gap coverage.

Thanks!

[ScottDLS]

I for one and glad this passed. I took my class(Texas CHL-100) in March along with my dad and a couple friends. I had several other family members that were planning on taking the class with us, but then my "brilliant" cousin found out that he could take the easy way out(and cheaper) and get a Utah license. He convinced his dad and the other family members that were going to take the class with us to do the same. I tried repeatedly to convince them that it was a stupid idea. What if Texas decides to not honor non-resident permits? Then you'll have to do it the right way and it will cost you more money in the long run. Of coarse he didn't listen.

When their "Utah instructor" came, he gave them the option of getting a Utah or Florida license. They opted for Florida. Does anyone know if Florida is contemplating a similar bill?

Florida is pretty expensive, and ironically they don't recognize non-res licenses from other states. They also require you to shoot. I doubt the Florida option saved them much money. The fee $117.00. I had one for a few years. It came in handy when my Texas CHL expired before DPS got around to processing my renewal. Now I have an AZ that I would use.

Interesting, they didn't have to shoot!!!!

I must have been wrong about the shooting part. There was some talk of it a few years ago and I thought Florida had added it to the class requirements. I used my DD-214 (Honorable Discharge). I did, in fact, qualify with a .45 when I was in the Navy...but not everyone did.