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As usual the government is only telling us what they want us to hear. If you believe their statement I agree with Apple
http://www.apple.com/customer-letter/

They can hack my phone anytime. I have an extensive collection of anti-Obama and anti-Democrat cartoons, some of them NSFW.

Apple simply does possess the will to do the right thing and obtain the information off the terrorist's phone without compromising innocent private users. And that is why I will never purchase any of their left wing Socialist products. YMMV, and that too, is your right.

If you read their statement the FBI wants them to develop a program to hack any phone, they are not interested in just getting what is on the terrorists phone. You can consider this "the right thing" if you consider invading everyone's privacy the right thing. If the FBI just asked for Apple to give them access to the phone it would not be an issue but that is not what they are asking.

mrvmax wrote:If you read their statement the FBI wants them to develop a program to hack any phone, they are not interested in just getting what is on the terrorists phone. You can consider this "the right thing" if you consider invading everyone's privacy the right thing. If the FBI just asked for Apple to give them access to the phone it would not be an issue but that is not what they are asking.

Apple CEO Tim Cook sucking up to current Apple customers, shareholders, and his Silicon Valley constituency.

On appeal Apple will likely lose this case - but by that time whatever actionable information is on the phone will be so aged as to have zero value.

Nice. I'm just sad that I can only NOT buy so many Apple products. I just canceled an order for 4 i-pads for work today.

Bitter Clinger wrote:

mrvmax wrote:If you read their statement the FBI wants them to develop a program to hack any phone, they are not interested in just getting what is on the terrorists phone. You can consider this "the right thing" if you consider invading everyone's privacy the right thing. If the FBI just asked for Apple to give them access to the phone it would not be an issue but that is not what they are asking.

Apple CEO Tim Cook sucking up to current Apple customers, shareholders, and his Silicon Valley constituency.

On appeal Apple will likely lose this case - but by that time whatever actionable information is on the phone will be so aged as to have zero value.

Nice. I'm just sad that I can only NOT buy so many Apple products. I just canceled an order for 4 i-pads for work today.

Because you prefer to use something that's easier to hack?

Bitter Clinger wrote:They can hack my phone anytime. I have an extensive collection of anti-Obama and anti-Democrat cartoons, some of them NSFW.

Apple simply does possess the will to do the right thing and obtain the information off the terrorist's phone without compromising innocent private users. And that is why I will never purchase any of their left wing Socialist products. YMMV, and that too, is your right.

You realize that that's kinda the opposite of how that phrase is normally used, right? In the context of siding with the people over the government, I mean.

Dave2 wrote:

Bitter Clinger wrote:

mrvmax wrote:If you read their statement the FBI wants them to develop a program to hack any phone, they are not interested in just getting what is on the terrorists phone. You can consider this "the right thing" if you consider invading everyone's privacy the right thing. If the FBI just asked for Apple to give them access to the phone it would not be an issue but that is not what they are asking.

Apple CEO Tim Cook sucking up to current Apple customers, shareholders, and his Silicon Valley constituency.

On appeal Apple will likely lose this case - but by that time whatever actionable information is on the phone will be so aged as to have zero value.

Nice. I'm just sad that I can only NOT buy so many Apple products. I just canceled an order for 4 i-pads for work today.

Because you prefer to use something that's easier to hack?

Hobbyist, right?

Bitter Clinger wrote: On appeal Apple will likely lose this case - but by that time whatever actionable information is on the phone will be so aged as to have zero value.

What is interesting is in past, Cook has said "we cannot decrypt data", "there is no backdoor".

He is not denying they could make a special iOS and install it on any phone and bypass the wipe/delay features.


hmmmm

Dave2 wrote:

Bitter Clinger wrote:They can hack my phone anytime. I have an extensive collection of anti-Obama and anti-Democrat cartoons, some of them NSFW.

Apple simply does possess the will to do the right thing and obtain the information off the terrorist's phone without compromising innocent private users. And that is why I will never purchase any of their left wing Socialist products. YMMV, and that too, is your right.

You realize that that's kinda the opposite of how that phrase is normally used, right? In the context of siding with the people over the government, I mean.

You can interpret it any way you want. I have nothing to hide, but will fight to the death for your right to privacy. However, a stinking piece of crap terrorist has NO rights, and his seized property should be used to the maximum extent to thwart terror. Now I know you think its difficult, and maybe it is, or maybe it really isn't, but it is the right thing to do and Apple should figure out a way to get that data and provide it to the Government. And however they do should never be disclosed. Not that difficult, trust me.

Bitter Clinger wrote:

Dave2 wrote:

Bitter Clinger wrote:They can hack my phone anytime. I have an extensive collection of anti-Obama and anti-Democrat cartoons, some of them NSFW.

Apple simply does possess the will to do the right thing and obtain the information off the terrorist's phone without compromising innocent private users. And that is why I will never purchase any of their left wing Socialist products. YMMV, and that too, is your right.

You realize that that's kinda the opposite of how that phrase is normally used, right? In the context of siding with the people over the government, I mean.

You can interpret it any way you want. I have nothing to hide, but will fight to the death for your right to privacy. However, a stinking piece of crap terrorist has NO rights, and his seized property should be used to the maximum extent to thwart terror. Now I know you think its difficult, and maybe it is, or maybe it really isn't, but it is the right thing to do and Apple should figure out a way to get that data and provide it to the Government. And however they do should never be disclosed. Not that difficult, trust me.

Issue isn't getting into a dirty terrorist phone, it's that they want them to create a backdoor into their software to allow them to get into all phones and I refuse to accept that
I will not give up my right to privacy in the name of fighting terrorism, the cost of freedom is not worth losing your freedom.

If it was only this phone you may have a point, but it's not just this phone it's all phones and they have clearly said they cooperated and gave them everything they can. If it was so simple wouldn't the fbi and nsa already have figured it out ?

My take is this: Apple can most likely create a tool to disable the protection against brute force attacks, which would allow the government to access the phone eventually. What the government wants is a tool to access the encryption on ANY iOS device and they are using this case to get a court order demanding it. I support getting access to the terrorists data, but I do not support allowing the government access to my information any time they wish to access it. I may be old fashioned but I kinda like that pesky fourth amendment.

Who cares? There is not piddlin' doo doo we can do about it except that we can buy Straight Talk phone from Walmart and go on about our business. Heck Fire! I can remember when we had to go home to to use the dial phone if we we wanted 'be connected'.

G.A. Heath wrote:My take is this: Apple can most likely create a tool to disable the protection against brute force attacks, which would allow the government to access the phone eventually. What the government wants is a tool to access the encryption on ANY iOS device and they are using this case to get a court order demanding it. I support getting access to the terrorists data, but I do not support allowing the government access to my information any time they wish to access it. I may be old fashioned but I kinda like that pesky fourth amendment.

This ^^

The analog to this is the atom bomb. Gov't asked scientists to developed it. They did. Gov't used it....just two times.... and then tried to protect it's secrets from hostile nations once the knowledge of its existence became public. Now, we can make very rational arguments for its necessity at the time Heck my own dad probably survived the war because those bombs were dropped, canceling Operation Downfall and the invasion of Japan for which he was training at the time. But within 4 years in 1949, the USSR detonated their first test bomb. The Brits had it by 1952. France had it by 1960; China in 1964; India by 1974. The genie was out of the bottle. At first, it was built and stockpiled by gov'ts which either could be trusted not to ever use it except in extremis, OR, as with the USSR, trusted to not use it because of the policy of mutually assured destruction. Today, the NORKS have the bomb. Pakistan has the bomb. Iran is building a bomb. Iraq under Saddam Hussein tried to build a bomb. The genie is not only well and truly out of the bottle, but it has gotten too big to be put back in.

If Apple does this, the genie is out of the bottle. For good.....so that the FBI can build a more complete case against two dead terrorists, and MAYBE find some leads on others. I don't want my personal security permanently violated for that purpose.

Bitter Clinger wrote:However, a stinking piece of crap terrorist has NO rights, and his seized property should be used to the maximum extent to thwart terror.

Actually, he was a US citizen, so he does have rights... or at least would if he were still alive. With all of the resources available to the US gov, I don't see why they can't get a few iPhones and a few geeks and reverse engineer it themselves. Seems like it should be a skill set that a gov agency has, but I guess No Such Agency exists...

And really, what do you expect to find on this phone? It belongs to his employer. They were smart enough to destroy personal phones and hard drives...

Sorry, I'm with Apple on this one. If the gov can't figure it out on their own, they should not be able to force a company to build a backdoor to bypass the encryption and security that the consumer has paid for. I have nothing to hide either, but I don't welcome the police into my home or my auto, so why would I want Apple to unlock my phone and let them in there?

cyphertext wrote:

Bitter Clinger wrote:However, a stinking piece of crap terrorist has NO rights, and his seized property should be used to the maximum extent to thwart terror.

Actually, he was a US citizen, so he does have rights... or at least would if he were still alive. With all of the resources available to the US gov, I don't see why they can't get a few iPhones and a few geeks and reverse engineer it themselves. Seems like it should be a skill set that a gov agency has, but I guess No Such Agency exists...

And really, what do you expect to find on this phone? It belongs to his employer. They were smart enough to destroy personal phones and hard drives...

Sorry, I'm with Apple on this one. If the gov can't figure it out on their own, they should not be able to force a company to build a backdoor to bypass the encryption and security that the consumer has paid for. I have nothing to hide either, but I don't welcome the police into my home or my auto, so why would I want Apple to unlock my phone and let them in there?

If Carly Fiorina ran Apple, it would already be done. Tim Cook is obviously being pressured by the Obama administration to hide that fact that these two were ISIS (The "S" stands for Syria just in case the Obama Adminsitarion is monitoring this post) bankrolled. Just like "Fast and Furious" and Hillary's explicit and deliberate breaking of her oath to protect National Secrets, this will never see the light of day until we have regime change.

And as a US Citizen, turned traitor, the only right that treasonous scum deserved is "last rites". My only regret is that he didn't suffer more.