Why No Citation - Update Page 2

[StewNTexas]

A few weeks ago my wife and I were making a short trip to the 'next' town, about 15 miles away. We entered onto a state divided highway heading North . Middle of the afternoon, sunny bright and dry day, posted speed limit of 70 mph.

As we were not in a hurry, I set the cruise for 65, loafing along in the right (outside) lane. Only a few cars, traffic was very light.

After about a mile, I caught a glimpse of a shadow in my rear view mirror, then BANG. Got rear ended almost centered just to the left of center on our hatchback. This was almost a pit manuever as seen on TV. How I kept control is still a mystery, but we got to the right on the shoulder, then moved a few more feet to the right to insure lots of clearance from traffic.

My wife seemed to be somewhat shaken up, so I called 911 for assistance. As an aside, I had to call two mores times to be sure someone was comming, and the total time was just over 15 minutes. My son-in-law and daughter were shopping in a Lowes about 5 miles away, and after calling them, they got there before a LEO or medical help.

Blew all the glass out of the rear of our Honda Fit, smashed the liftgate, banged the whole back end in, and curled a part of the left rear frame in on the tire.

A state trooper pulled up (DPS) about the time the ambulance arrived. The lady that hit us had gotten out of her double cab F250 and said that she did not see us. Give me a break. The car is Texas Burnt Orange, and I don't think there is a brighter color available.

The EMS crew checked my wife over, and said that she did not need to be transported at that time, but be sure to see her primary care doctor the next day.

A wrecker came to load my Honda for a trip to their yard for storage. While all this was happening, I asked the DPS officer if he could provide me information regarding the other driver. He gave me a paper in his handwriting with her name and insurance information and his signature.

As it takes a few days for the data to get into the DPS system, we were not able to get an incident report for five days.

NO CITATION was issued. The auto dealer with my vehicle told us that the other vehicle must have been going at least 85 MPH to cause the damage we incurred.

I still have the handwritten note from the DPS officer with his information. Should I contact him, or his office, to see why no citation was issued. Everything MAY work out as the driver that hit us did have insurance, the same company that we have.

Should I just sit back and keep quiet, or try to get some additional information. It appears my wife will be in treatment for a number of weeks. I should mention that she was released from an ICU the previous day after a four day stay in the hospital.

I would think a minimum of failure to control speed, or something similar would be in order. The other person did a 'lane drift' of at least six feet to the right to have hit us where they did. Inattention to driving or something.

[Jumping Frog]

Whether that driver was ticketed or not will not change your insurance situation. A rear-ender like that is obviously the other vehicle's fault.

I hope your wife will be OK. I've said a prayer for her speedy healing to full recovery.

[tbrown]

Did the police witness the collision?

[Heartland Patriot]

Whether that driver was ticketed or not will not change your insurance situation. A rear-ender like that is obviously the other vehicle's fault.

I hope your wife will be OK. I've said a prayer for her speedy healing to full recovery.

I guess I've been operating under the same impression as the OP. Namely, that unless someone gets a ticket out of it, then the insurance companies do their little dance to figure out who pays, and even if the other person was in the wrong, you still might get a bum deal. I thought that if law enforcement issues a ticket, then it helps prove fault. Has that NEVER been true, or did the law change, or what? I'm curious.

[RPB]

In Injury cases, parts of an accident report may (or may not be) admissible.
The officer who was not an eyewitness, writes down his opinion based upon what was told to him (hearsay)
On the accident report is a box "officer's narrative/opinion ..."
That may or may not be redacted/whited out in a civil trial...(usually isn't, but depends on the Attorneys and if they think of it and file the motions)
The officer first needs to be qualified as an expert to render an expert opinion for his opinion of what caused it based upon his experience investigating accidents etc etc to be entered into evidence.
The outcome of a *criminal fine/ticket" probably would be inadmissible in a civil trial.... different courts.

In short .. doesn't really/theoretically matter if the other guy got a ticket, although the Adjuster may try to use that as a point in negotiating the value of the claim. They'll use anything they can... either side will .. it's "negotiating"

People in hit and runs don't get tickets if they aren't caught, yet your own insurer may require you to file suit and show proof of contact to prove yo didn't take faulty evasive action.

Example, an intoxicated person stopped at a red light gets hit by a sober person who rear-ends him/her, the drunk gets cited for DWI, the person who rear-ended him/her dies in the crash so no citation is issued to the deceased... whose fault was the wreck?

What occurs in one court system/Family Court/Probate Court/Criminal Court isn't necessarily admissible in a Civil Trial, but yeah, Insurers sometimes look to how a citation was resolved during their investigation of fault/negligence-especially in arguing value.

You could call and ask why no ticket ... be nice to the officer though, you may need his help later.

[Jumping Frog]

I thought that if law enforcement issues a ticket, then it helps prove fault. Has that NEVER been true, or did the law change, or what? I'm curious.

If fault is ambiguous, then a ticket for a traffic infraction, like running a stop sign or a red light, could help establish fault, but it still needs to be supported by evidence. In most accidents, comparative fault is negotiated between the insurance companies, not established at trial anyway.

But getting rear-ended is so crystal clear, I wouldn't worry about it.

A read ender has to be a really obscure circumstance with compelling evidence for the one case in a thousand that may have doubt. The other 999 times, the person with the damage on the front bumper is the one at fault.

[Oldgringo]

Texting?

[steve817]

Texting?

That is what I was thinking.

[Heartland Patriot]

I thought that if law enforcement issues a ticket, then it helps prove fault. Has that NEVER been true, or did the law change, or what? I'm curious.

If fault is ambiguous, then a ticket for a traffic infraction, like running a stop sign or a red light, could help establish fault, but it still needs to be supported by evidence. In most accidents, comparative fault is negotiated between the insurance companies, not established at trial anyway.

But getting rear-ended is so crystal clear, I wouldn't worry about it.

A read ender has to be a really obscure circumstance with compelling evidence for the one case in a thousand that may have doubt. The other 999 times, the person with the damage on the front bumper is the one at fault.

Okay, I understand what you are saying. But I do have a story to cover your example...this happened to my wife when we were living in California, in a small farm town. She pulled up behind a pickup truck at a stop sign where the road crossed the local highway in town. She wasn't right up on the guy's bumper, there was a definite gap, and she was in a Hyundai Tucson, which sits up a little bit. The truck was sticking out into the roadway just a bit, and a piece of farm equipment that was a little wide came along in the near lane. The truck threw it in reverse, without looking back, and hit my wife's front bumper. He actually got out and apologized, and gave his insurance info without any hassle, but it still took a while to get the money to fix that.

[jimlongley]

. . . In short .. doesn't really/theoretically matter if the other guy got a ticket, although the Adjuster may try to use that as a point in negotiating the value of the claim. They'll use anything they can... either side will .. it's "negotiating"

People in hit and runs don't get tickets if they aren't caught, yet your own insurer may require you to file suit and show proof of contact to prove yo didn't take faulty evasive action.

Example, an intoxicated person stopped at a red light gets hit by a sober person who rear-ends him/her, the drunk gets cited for DWI, the person who rear-ended him/her dies in the crash so no citation is issued to the deceased... whose fault was the wreck?

What occurs in one court system/Family Court/Probate Court/Criminal Court isn't necessarily admissible in a Civil Trial, but yeah, Insurers sometimes look to how a citation was resolved during their investigation of fault/negligence-especially in arguing value.

You could call and ask why no ticket ... be nice to the officer though, you may need his help later.

Back a long time ago (1968) I came to an intersection that was under construction. It was going to be a 4 lane divided by 4 lane divided grade crossing controlled by multiple lights, but the lights had not yet been activated yet, so the entire mess was controlled by one light, hung off center above the intersection.

I was headed southbound and slowed for the green light in my direction and turned left to go eastbound and to my dismay I found myself in the westbound lane. I stopped my car and was about to put it in reverse when the light changed about four or five hundred feet ahead of me, where a cross street entered the westbound lane. Sitting at that light were two vehicles and as I watched in morbid fascination, the headlights of the one facing me in the lane I was in raised up and I could hear its engine roar as the driver drag raced with the other car. BTW, the other car was not racing with him.

With little or no time to do more than just sit there and watch, that's what I did, as the guy driving the car that was racing came right down that lane and hit me head on with enough velocity to push my '65 Merc Monterey backwards 35 feet with a '59 Nash Rambler wagon. The Merc was way heavier than the Rambler, so he really had to be hauling.

My right shoulder was dislocated, my left hand was broken, and my glasses had come off and broken and gashed my face, so I looked pretty bad. The other guy never even saw me because he was concentrating on watching for the other car, but he was not injured, although his passenger was pretty bashed up. I got out of my car, I'm not sure how, and while the driver of the other car ran up and down the median shouting at me and making a variety of threats against me, my family, and several generations in either direction, I noted that the passenger side of his windshield was in pretty bad shape, so my rescue squad instincts kicked in and I went over to check on his passenger.

It happened that I knew the passenger, so I got my big first aid kit (I was a Red Cross Instructor) out of the trunk of my car, about the only part that survived unbent, and tended to her injuries while the other driver demonstrated his lack of control by wetting his pants and the harassing the various arriving cops.

First they thought he was the driver of my car and vice versa, but I did eventually correct them, but he obviously had been drinking, quite a lot, and he ended up in the back of a squad car with cuffs on, arrested for DWI and a variety of other charges.

I was in the Navy at the time and had to return to my ship, but my insurance agent and attorney kept me apprised of what went on. Due to NY State laws in effect at the time, I was not held responsible for the wreck, even though I was in the wrong lane going the wrong direction, because the other guy was convicted of DWI and other stuff, and had had several previous convictions for traffic related stuff, including racing. Although he did hire a lawyer and send notice of intent to file suit, it never happened, and his (father's) insurance did not subrogate against my insurance, but my agent told me that his father's insurance was canceled and he was placed in a minimum coverage assigned risk pool with a restriction against the son driving his vehicles. My insurance paid for through the collision coverage on my vehicle, and did subrogate against the other driver because of his conviction, but I do not know whether that was successful.

A few months later I met and shortly married my first (late) wife who happened to be a CPCU and explained some of the arcane inner workings of NY State Insurance Law at the time, and such things were not unusual. That all changed when "No Fault" came in.

[powerboatr]

Texting?

let the insurance folks tackle the court orders for the drivers cell records...

big thing is your ok and your wife a speedy recovery
your ALIVE
your honda is broken and should be fixed or totaled which may or may not help you
i still dont understand with "smart phones, etc" why they don't go TEXT disable over 3 mph gps,

again glad your ok

[brainman]

I would think they don't disable texting over 3 mph because there's nothing wrong with my passengers texting like mad while I'm driving 70mph.

[Skiprr]

I won't get into how much I abhor texting-while-driving.

I see it daily. And the resultant expertise at the wheel is no different than a non-texting driver slugging down a fifth of Glenfiddich before punching his Lexus up to 90 in a 65...then slowing back to 55, weaving a bit...then gunning it to 85 again because you try to pass him...then slowing back to 50 for a very important message, while drifting in and out of the lanes both right and left.

The only traffic accident I've had in three decades happened a few years ago. I was in Houston's Westchase district heading southbound in the the second lane of the Sam Houston Parkway. It was mid-afternoon, the traffic was wide open, and I was doing a hair under 70 in a 65. A black F150 came up behind me like I was standing still. I realized the driver wasn't changing lanes and I punched it, trying to get my speed up as quickly as possible. No time to evaluate whether the lanes to my right or left were open.

Bam. Rear-ended while doing at least 75 on the tollway.

It was a very young woman driving her boyfriend's truck. She claimed she was trying to avoid being rear-ended by another truck that had been riding her bumper.

Uh huh. Right. Even though no other vehicle even came close to engaging with our collision.

Before I even spoke to her, I began taking copious numbers of photos of the scene, my car, and her truck.

TIP: Photograph everything as quickly as possible, before stuff moves.

TIP: Most phones also have audio recording capability: turn it on immediately. Capture everything you can.

TIP: Never say, to anyone, that you feel fine following a collision. You may feel okay at the scene, but it may take many hours before symptoms become apparent.

No LEO came to the scene of this accident, and in urban situations I believe that's the norm. Even if a vehicle has to be towed, there may be no LEO response unless injuries are reported.

My collision expenses worked out okay, and I believe that was in large part due to my aggressive photography of the scene.

And, no, I wasn't injured. It was about a 15 mph collision (75 mph + 90 mph).

[JALLEN]

Many years ago, I rear ended a brown SUV that pulled in front of me by about 10 feet and immediately slammed on the brakes, at 65 mph. I was driving a brand new Lexus which sustained what turned out to be almost $10,000 in damage. I got to the side of the highway, somewhat shaken, and the other car disappeared down the road. There were few cell phones back then, and I didn't have mine installed in the new car yet. The Lexus was operable, so I made it to my home nearby and called CHP to report.

To my surprise, the operator said another operator was taking a report from a witness who told CHP that he saw the incident, and followed the brown SUV off the next ramp into a park and ride where the driver got out took and look at the rear and drove away. The witness jotted down the license plate numbers. I went down to CHP the next day and gave a written report, and never heard another peep about it. Insurance covered repairs to the car, and that was that.

CHP surmised that the other driver didn't want anyone to know where he was, or with whom, or what he had in the car, etc. Whoever it was was in a heap of trouble!

No citation means nothing, and in many cases officers can issue citations for offenses committed in their presence only. Insurance will sort this out, albeit somewhat imperfectly from your perspective.

[E.Marquez]

i still dont understand with "smart phones, etc" why they don't go TEXT disable over 3 mph gps,

Because the last thing we need is MORE nanny state laws and regulation.
Because it's perfectly safe for a passenger in a moving vehicle to txt
Because it's perfectly safe for a drives phone to receive a txt in a moving vehicle.
Because if it's not the smart phone, it will be a burger dropped in the lap, or the CD player needing attention, Ipod hooked into the sound system, makeup in the rear view mirror, paper map needing refolded, GPS way point needing marked, Radar detector detecting, or not......

Because we already have laws that make driving distracted illegal.. how about we just enforce those