Open Carry Questions

[drjoker]

The following quote from the law says that to forbid a concealed handgun they must have a 30.06 sign that can only be in English only and very tiny OR a sign that is in English, Spanish, and is at least 1 inch in lettering height. In other words, are the English/Spanish and 1 inch letter height requirements optional, now?!

Also, there is a separate 30.07 sign that forbid open carry. So, theoretically, you can have a place that bans either only open carry, only concealed carry, bans both OC and CC, or bans nothing? In other words, you see a 30.06 sign, but you can still OC?

Thanks,

a card or other document on which is written
language identical to the following: "Pursuant to Section
30.06
,
Penal Code (trespass by
license holder
with [of license to carry
] a
concealed handgun), a person licensed under Subchapter H, Chapter
411, Government Code ([concealed
] handgun
licensing law), may not
enter this property with a concealed handgun"; OR
(B)
AA
a sign posted on the property that:
(i)
AA
includes the language described by
Paragraph (A) in both English and Spanish;
(ii)
AA
appears in contrasting colors with
block letters at least one inch in height; and
(iii)
AA
is displayed in a conspicuous manner
clearly visible to the public

[jmra]

The following quote from the law says that to forbid a concealed handgun they must have a 30.06 sign that can only be in English only and very tiny OR a sign that is in English, Spanish, and is at least 1 inch in lettering height. In other words, are the English/Spanish and 1 inch letter height requirements optional, now?!

Also, there is a separate 30.07 sign that forbid open carry. So, theoretically, you can have a place that bans either only open carry, only concealed carry, bans both OC and CC, or bans nothing? In other words, you see a 30.06 sign, but you can still OC?

Thanks,

a card or other document on which is written
language identical to the following: "Pursuant to Section
30.06
,
Penal Code (trespass by
license holder
with [of license to carry
] a
concealed handgun), a person licensed under Subchapter H, Chapter
411, Government Code ([concealed
] handgun
licensing law), may not
enter this property with a concealed handgun"; OR
(B)
AA
a sign posted on the property that:
(i)
AA
includes the language described by
Paragraph (A) in both English and Spanish;
(ii)
AA
appears in contrasting colors with
block letters at least one inch in height; and
(iii)
AA
is displayed in a conspicuous manner
clearly visible to the public

The requirements for 30.06 has always been that way. You may be confusing the requirements for a sign vs. the requirements for a card handed to you. The sign still has to be in both English and Spanish with one inch letters and contrasting background. The wording is the only change in 30.06 which becomes effective 1-1-16.

[drjoker]

So, can you open carry in a 30.06 place that is NOT 30.07 posted? At least, until you are given verbal notice not to carry?

[jmra]

So, can you open carry in a 30.06 place that is NOT 30.07 posted? At least, until you are given verbal notice not to carry?

On or after 1-1-16, yes. Also since the wording changes on 30.06 all current 30.06 signs would technically be invalid.

[drjoker]

nice. thanks.

So, can you open carry in a 30.06 place that is NOT 30.07 posted? At least, until you are given verbal notice not to carry?

On or after 1-1-16, yes. Also since the wording changes on 30.06 all current 30.06 signs would technically be invalid.

[K.Mooneyham]

Of course, what I'm going to say here is my own personal opinion and YMMV. However, if a place has the current (old) 30.06, I won't carry there. If they have a new 30.06 sign but no 30.07 sign, I won't carry there. If they have a 30.07 sign only, I will concealed carry there. The reason I won't open carry past any 30.06 sign is I am not playing a dangerous game. That game is called "MWAG" phone call, perhaps brought to you by some anti-2A, anti-self-defense type. I understand the intent of the signs, I understand the intent of the law, I understand the hard work that Mr. Cotton and some of the legislators put in this session, I understand that "a right not exercised is a right lost". And yet, I worry about nervous police officers who have been given incorrect information by who knows what person for who knows what reason. Also, I am a man of modest means who cannot afford to defend himself against an overzealous ADA who needs a notch in the proverbial belt, just so I can shop in some particular establishment. I carry because my life, and those of my family, are worth more than my possessions and my bank account, but I can find a different establishment that wants my money if one particular one does not. And I can almost guarantee that certain people in this state are working on methodology to instruct certain police forces in how to cause maximum problems for those who OC, especially if any sort of MWAG calls come in. All that said, I believe that few places will put up signs at all and it will largely be a moot issue, if you stay out of certain large municipalities. Like I said, YMMV.

[joe817]

Well put K.Mooneyham! I follow the same logic and philosophy.

[jmra]

I'm not suggesting anyone carry or not carry past an invalid sign. I'm just stating what will be factual on 1-1-16. People will have to make their own decisions on the old 30.06 sign.

[Oldgringo]

GEEEZ! How many new signs will there be on 01/01/2016?

Is there a READER'S DIGEST (25 words or less in lay terms) version of these new signs anywhere for those of us with short attention spans?

[ScottDLS]

If a place has a 30.06 sign and you open carry, you'll very likely be given verbal (no, i'm not going to say oral) notice pretty quickly. Figure if they go to the trouble to prohibit CC they'll stop you from OC.

[Vol Texan]

GEEEZ! How many new signs will there be on 01/01/2016?

Is there a READER'S DIGEST (25 words or less in lay terms) version of these new signs anywhere for those of us with short attention spans?

OldGringo...Sorry, 25 words won't cut it, but if you read the 26 words shown in large font below, it should guide you through the important stuff. This is the most concise version I can conjure up for you regarding the signs only (as usual, the same wording on a card or document - or oral notification) will also be considered valid).

For both sets of signs, most of the old rules apply:

• include the language above in both English and Spanish;
• appear in contrasting colors with block letters at least one inch in height
• However, the requirement for where the sign is posted is worded slightly differently from one sign to the other, and I've indicated this in red font below.

The 30.07 sign is for OPEN CARRY only:
THIS IS A NEW SIGN

Pursuant to Section 30.07, Penal Code (trespass by license holder with an openly carried handgun), a person licensed under Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code (handgun licensing law), may not enter this property with a handgun that is carried openly

The sign must be displayed in a conspicuous manner clearly visible to the public at each entrance to the property
(this underlined section is slightly different from the 30.06 sign placement rules).

The 30.06 sign is for CONCEALED CARRY only:
THIS IS A REWORDING OF THE OLD 30.06 SIGN

Pursuant to Section 30.06, Penal Code (trespass by license holder with a concealed handgun), a person licensed under Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code (handgun licensing law), may not enter this property with a concealed handgun

Note that the language has changed from the old 30.06 sign. The old language is below:

Pursuant to Section 30.06, Penal Code (trespass by holder of license to carry a concealed handgun), a person licensed under Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code (concealed handgun law), may not enter this property with a concealed handgun

The sign must be displayed in a conspicuous manner clearly visible to the public
(this is slightly different from the 30.07 sign placement rules because it is missing the underlined section shown in 30.07 above).

If someone wants to block both kinds of carry, both signs must be posted!

[drjoker]

Very nice. Who should I thank for this? Mr. Cotton? The NRA?

Man, one of my biggest concerns with concealed carry is accidentally carrying past a 30.06 posted property by not using the entrance where it is posted. THAT's why I'm a NRA life member, man.

The sign must be displayed in a conspicuous manner clearly visible to the public at each entrance to the property

[Vol Texan]

Very nice. Who should I thank for this? Mr. Cotton? The NRA?

Man, one of my biggest concerns with concealed carry is accidentally carrying past a 30.06 posted property by not using the entrance where it is posted. THAT's why I'm a NRA life member, man.

Not anymore (after 1 Jan 2016, that is)!

Accidentally carrying past a 30.06 is reduced from a Class A to a Class C misdemeanor (effectively the same level as a $200 traffic ticket). After having done so, if they inform you orally and you refuse to leave, then it is a Class A.

This also applies to 30.07.

The red text has been edited to correct my error (thanks to casp625 for pointing it out ). It is correct now.

[casp625]

Very nice. Who should I thank for this? Mr. Cotton? The NRA?

Man, one of my biggest concerns with concealed carry is accidentally carrying past a 30.06 posted property by not using the entrance where it is posted. THAT's why I'm a NRA life member, man.

Not anymore (after 1 Jan 2016, that is)!

Accidentally carrying past a 30.06 is reduced from a Class A to a Class C misdemeanor (effectively the same level as a $200 traffic ticket). After having done so, if they inform you orally and you refuse to leave, then it is a Class A.

This is only for 30.06, however...the penalty for carrying past a 30.07 sign is still a Class A.

Incorrect. Class C applies to 30.07 as well unless you are asked to leave and don't.

[The Wall]

I wish they would just go to one sign. 30.06/07 for instance. Common sense tells you if an establishment doesn't want concealed carry they certainly don't want open carry. But then again there are some that don't mind concealed carry but don't want open carry. So I guess that's why they have to have two signs. So much for my common sense theory. How about they put both signs on one piece of paper with a perforated line in the middle, and you can cut off the part you don't want.