Law regarding dropping off children at school?

[vonfilm]

What is the law regarding carrying on one's person or in the glovebox while dropping off a child at school in the school's driveway?

Also what is the law about parking on school property or near school property with a handgun in the glovebox? This would be while attending your child's school functions. I would of course never carry into the school building. I am pretty clear that is forbidden.

My son attends an Austin, TX elementary school. His school does not display one of those no firearms signs that I have seen on other Austin elementary schools. I don't know whether this matters or not.

[seamusTX]

If you have a CHL, you can carry a handgun on your person or in your vehicle on school grounds, except for grounds where a school-sponsored event are being held.

If you do not have a CHL, it's better not to have any kind of weapon on school grounds. It's not illegal under Texas law, but it is illegal under federal law.

Signs posted on public schools have no legal effect. A valid 30.06 sign on a private school is binding.

- Jim

Edited to correct typo.

[vonfilm]

I should have said that I do have a CHL.

[seamusTX]

I should have said that I do have a CHL.

I figured you did, since you posted in the CHL section, but there has been a lot of discussion of unlicensed car-carry lately.

- Jim

[familyman]

I had a conversation with a friend of mine last night. He is LEO. He advised me that CCL or not, school in session or not. School function happening or not that having a firearm on the propety of the school was against the law. I told him that I was taught that on the property was not against the law. That a CHL holder could disarm in the car, secure the weapon, do his buisness in the school and return to his car without being in violation of the law. He told me that I was wrong and that his DA had accepted charges against someone for doing exactly that.

[seamusTX]

I had a conversation with a friend of mine last night. He is LEO. He advised me that CCL or not, school in session or not. School function happening or not that having a firearm on the propety of the school was against the law.

You could ask him to show you exactly which law make it illegal.

There is no such law.

- Jim

[AEA]

I had a conversation with a friend of mine last night. He is LEO. He advised me that CCL or not, school in session or not. School function happening or not that having a firearm on the propety of the school was against the law. I told him that I was taught that on the property was not against the law. That a CHL holder could disarm in the car, secure the weapon, do his buisness in the school and return to his car without being in violation of the law. He told me that I was wrong and that his DA had accepted charges against someone for doing exactly that.

Gotta be another "Rosenthal Law"! But since familyman referenced CCL, makes me wonder if he is in Texas.

Please let us know what State/Dept. your LEO friend works familyman. Thanks.

[vonfilm]

Could anyone post a link to the Texas statutes that allow a CHL holder to carry while dropping off a child while in your car or on foot and storing a handgun in the vehicle while walking into the school.

How is a school function different than the regular school day? Is this like a carnival or a football game?

[Charles L. Cotton]

I had a conversation with a friend of mine last night. He is LEO. He advised me that CCL or not, school in session or not. School function happening or not that having a firearm on the propety of the school was against the law. I told him that I was taught that on the property was not against the law. That a CHL holder could disarm in the car, secure the weapon, do his buisness in the school and return to his car without being in violation of the law. He told me that I was wrong and that his DA had accepted charges against someone for doing exactly that.

Tell your friend his is wrong and to look at TPC §46.03(a)(1) & (c)(1), as well as §46.035(f)(3). You might also mention that arresting someone for something that is clearly not illegal is a civil rights violation and can subject him and his department to a §1983 suit. It matters not if he was following departmental policy, or that his DA would accept charges.

Chas.

§ 46.03. PLACES WEAPONS PROHIBITED. (a) A person commits an offense if the person intentionally, knowingly, or ecklessly possesses or goes with a firearm, illegal knife, club, or rohibited weapon listed in Section 46.05(a):

• (1) on the physical premises of a school or educational institution, any grounds or building on which an activity sponsored by a school or educational institution is being conducted, or a passenger transportation vehicle of a school or educational institution, whether the school or educational institution is public or private, unless pursuant to written
  regulations or written authorization of the institution;

. . .

(c) In this section:

• (1) "Premises" has the meaning assigned by Section 46.035.

§ 46.035. UNLAWFUL CARRYING OF HANDGUN BY LICENSE HOLDER.
. . .
(f) In this section:

• (3) "Premises" means a building or a portion of a building. The term does not include any public or private driveway, street, sidewalk or walkway, parking lot, parking garage, or other parking area.

[familyman]

Chas,
I will inform him of the TPC that you have pointed out. He is in fact a HCSO. I am in Texas, Harris County in fact. I have my CHL and used the CCL reference by mistake.

Scenario for consideration.

My child gets dropped off in the morning to a child care facility by the wife. The child care facility takes him to and from school. After school, I go to said facility and pick up my child. He is not at school. They have picked up from several schools and there are school kids there. Some doing homework, some playing. I enter the facility and sign my child out as required by the facility. Am I in violation as a CHL holder for entering this facility armed and concealed?

What if it is in a church where these kids are?


I think I am clear. It is not a school. There are babysitters at this facility, not teachers. I could run into a babysitter at Wal-Mart.

Thanks in advance,
FM

[Kalrog]

A daycare is not a prohibited location. Neither is a church. This assumes that you have not received proper notice under 30.06 to not carry.

See TPC 30.06 for this information.

[AEA]

I am in Texas, Harris County in fact.

Gotta be another "Rosenthal Law"!

BOY.....I hit the nail on the head there!

[frankie_the_yankee]

§ 46.03. PLACES WEAPONS PROHIBITED. (a) A person commits an offense if the person intentionally, knowingly, or ecklessly possesses or goes with a firearm, illegal knife, club, or rohibited weapon listed in

Section 46.05(a):

(1) on the physical premises of a school or educational institution, any grounds or building on which an activity sponsored by a school or educational institution is being conducted, or a passenger transportation vehicle of a school or educational institution, whether the school or educational institution is public or private, unless pursuant to written
regulations or written authorization of the institution;

. . .

(c) In this section:

(1) "Premises" has the meaning assigned by Section 46.035.

I think I am pretty clear on the intent of the legislators here. They wanted to allow for parents to drop off and pick up students while having a weapon in their cars. And I fully agree that this is how it should be (at least. Actually, I would favor CHL's being allowed to carry in schools without any restrictions, but that is a different issue.).

But do you (Chas) think there is any way a DA could read the law such that children entering or leaving the school could be classified as "an activity sponsored by a school or educational institution"?

If so, carrying while dropping off or picking up would be against the law.

What is the legal definition of "activity" as it appplies in the referenced statute?

[chewy555]

Frankie you got to it first, I was thinking the same thing.

Familyman, I think that the daycare is not a school. And as long as there is not 30.06 sign on the door you are good to go. Thats just how I see it.

[Charles L. Cotton]

But do you (Chas) think there is any way a DA could read the law such that children entering or leaving the school could be classified as "an activity sponsored by a school or educational institution"?

No, entering and leaving a building is not a "sponsored" activity. I have been critical of Rosenthal's interpretation of the now-repealed presumption of traveling, but I have no reason to believe he would try to prosecute anyone under these conditions. To be perfectly honest, I don't think anyone in the Harris County DA's office actually said they would accept charges under these circumstances. I suspect that was just inaccurate locker-room banter. I'm not saying the Deputy is lying and that he never heard that statement made; I just think he heard inaccurate information, or information based upon a different fact pattern.

Chas.