Police want to check your serial #

[MeMelYup]

Let's try it this way. A police officer runs the serial number on your handgun to see if it has been reported stolen. Why would the PO think your firearm was stolen in the first place? What gave the PO reason to believe that your firearm was stolen. What was the probable cause to give the PO the idea that your firearm was stolen? Does the PO think everyone with a CHL is a thief? The PO is implying that all CHL's, or that individual person, are thieves by running the firearm serial number to see if it is stolen. By running the serial number of the firearm the PO is doing a search, because he/she is searching to see if they may have reason to confiscate your firearm and possibly site you with being in possession of stolen property, or question you about having stolen property. Nuff said.

[Jaguar]

Let's try it this way. A police officer runs the serial number on your handgun to see if it has been reported stolen. Why would the PO think your firearm was stolen in the first place? What gave the PO reason to believe that your firearm was stolen. What was the probable cause to give the PO the idea that your firearm was stolen? Does the PO think everyone with a CHL is a thief? The PO is implying that all CHL's, or that individual person, are thieves by running the firearm serial number to see if it is stolen. By running the serial number of the firearm the PO is doing a search, because he/she is searching to see if they may have reason to confiscate your firearm and possibly site you with being in possession of stolen property, or question you about having stolen property. Nuff said.

When you give someone a fishing license they are going to go fish.

[TomsTXCHL]

As a practical matter, I never (EVER) would hand my loaded weapon to anyone (except I suppose if we're side-by-side on the range shooting the thing, though I've never done THAT either).

So if I am asked to produce my CCW, and it is in e.g. a pocket holster, cocked & locked, am I expected to hand it over as-is?

Did I miss it, or is the answer to this question absolutely "hand it over as-is"...?

Any LEO here who can respond?

The last thing an LEO wants is you to put your hands on the weapon. If they want to disarm you, they will remove the weapon.

OK then I get that the answer is to say "ok officer it's in located here-or-there and if you like I will raise my hands while you remove it" or some such. Including offering to get out of the vehicle if it's in my pocket or otherwise hard to get at.

Common sense in hindsight I suppose, but I can well imagine being discombobulated by such a question (being the ultimate law-abiding non-confrontational person that I am).

[bigcarl64]

Easy solution is to put a plastic sticker of similar color on the gun covering the serial number. I have not found anything in TX statutes that prohibits covering the serial number. No more plain sight.

[cb1000rider]

Easy solution is to put a plastic sticker of similar color on the gun covering the serial number. I have not found anything in TX statutes that prohibits covering the serial number. No more plain sight.

That sounds like a bad idea to me. You just covered the serial number. It's enough to trigger interest some LEO interest... Assuming that covering the serial doesn't serve a practical purpose (like a grip) - then you just provided a fact that is probably material in justifying a search.

I don't like the fact that the serial can be run either, but as the firearm can be removed from your person, that's just how it is.. There are bigger points of contention that I'm concerned about.

[bigcarl64]

Probable cause is a justification for anything now it seems. We have 4-legged judges on leashes that are used to justify warrantless searches. As someone who works in IT and knows relatives that work in law enforcement IT, I speak from experience that anytime a request is run for any number, DL, insurance, weapon serial number, it is logged permanently into a database. That database is then used when any future contact is made with the individual, and can easily be mined by authorities in the future. Well, not can be, but will be. Once the serial number is ran, it is logged forever in the database. You are now forever connected with that weapon.

As far as the LEO knowing if you are a CHL holder or not during a traffic stop, the dispatcher informs the LEO of the plate owner of the vehicle has a CHL. 9 times out of 10 it is the same person as the driver. So they know before even exiting their vehicle.

[nightmare69]

Probable cause is a justification for anything now it seems. We have 4-legged judges on leashes that are used to justify warrantless searches. As someone who works in IT and knows relatives that work in law enforcement IT, I speak from experience that anytime a request is run for any number, DL, insurance, weapon serial number, it is logged permanently into a database. That database is then used when any future contact is made with the individual, and can easily be mined by authorities in the future. Well, not can be, but will be. Once the serial number is ran, it is logged forever in the database. You are now forever connected with that weapon.

You are talking about NCIC correct? If so LEO's have to have PC to run a person through it. LEO's can be charged with a 2nd degree felony running someone for some form of payment. The feds take NCIC very serious, I know of an officer who was also a landlord who lost his job and did some time in jail for running people backgrounds before he would rent them a house. I have limited access to NCIC and to be honest Im scared to death to even try to log on.

As far as the LEO knowing if you are a CHL holder or not during a traffic stop, the dispatcher informs the LEO of the plate owner of the vehicle has a CHL. 9 times out of 10 it is the same person as the driver. So they know before even exiting their vehicle.

Never seen an officer know if the person is a CHL holder or not until they run their DL. The computers cops have in their vehicles, (MDT's) some departments have an automated program that allows the officer to enter the license plate and all it tells is the registered owners name and vehicle description. Ive been with officers that ran the tag, pulled them over and the driver had a CHL, once he scanned the DL the program informed the officer that the driver did have a valid CHL.

[bigcarl64]

NCIC is administered and run by the alphabet soup on the East Coast. TCIC (Tx DPS) is specifically where this stuff is logged, and at the local level in whatever county you were in. This is often shared with the alphabet soups, but only if you are deemed to be dangerous and a known criminal. Evey traffic stop is logged, regardless.. Date, time, place, and any and every detail about that stop. LEOs are required to log the info in their MDT before they even get out of the vehicle, or at least notify dispatch of the same. The vehicle plate information is cross referenced against the DL database and the officer has that info before he/she approaches the driver. Any known drug history, better yet, anything for that matter where the name has a hit in the database from any time period. Listen to the DPS radio chatter..

Wise up people, a database is being built and the excuse is safety.