3rd or 5th Renewal - No Class

[PaulTX]

I just learned that if you are on your 3rd or 5th renewal no class is required! I called TXDPS and learned I'm on the 3rd renewal - yea!

On Saturday the 11th I'm driving to the Texas Handgun Academy in Dallas where they will do the photos, fingerprints, paperwork, etc. for $35. It would be nice if the letter DPS sends out told you about the 3rd or 5th renewal and your renewal number! I guess that would be too easy.

Paul

[Charles L. Cotton]

When that change passed in 2007, DPS initially stated they were going to notify CHLs in the renewal letter that a renewal class was optional. The decision was made later not to do that. I suspect it is because the training division hates that provision! It allows CHLs to go 10 years without a class, which translates to 5 legislative sessions in which substantial changes in the law can be passed. The training division is very protective and supportive of CHLs constantly referring to them as "our people" or "our CHLs." (Note, I said the "training division.") I truly believe they feel this change poses a risk to CHLs.

Chas.

[CWOOD]

When that change passed in 2007, DPS initially stated they were going to notify CHLs in the renewal letter that a renewal class was optional. The decision was made later not to do that. I suspect it is because the training division hates that provision! It allows CHLs to go 10 years without a class, which translates to 5 legislative sessions in which substantial changes in the law can be passed. The training division is very protective and supportive of CHLs constantly referring to them as "our people" or "our CHLs." (Note, I said the "training division.") I truly believe they feel this change poses a risk to CHLs.

Chas.

Charles, I think they might be right.

Judging for the questions asked repeatedly on this forum, and, I suspect other places, it is hard enough for some folks (unfortunately, including some instructors) to keep up with laws in effect when they first got their CHL, I can see how many folks could get behind and get themselves in trouble. And when they do, you can bet that the drive by news media will flog it for all it is worth.

Perhaps in some future session, DPS might be encouraged to at least mail out of CHL who are eligible to skip the class a summary of significant changes since the last one they recieved training for. I would hate to add more duties to them given their current staffing/funding levels, but it they did it, at least there could be no legitimate excuses from someone claiming not to know the changes.

Thank Goodness for TexasCHLforum.

[Greybeard]

I'm probably in the same camp as the guys in DPS' training dept. Just this past week, a "semi-seasoned" CHL instructor was at the range and, in discussions with him about lesson plans, it became obvious that he (one of many "part timers" in the biz) thought churches were off limits. And in a CHL renewal class last night, I had an older gentleman (who took his prior class elsewhere!) who thought he could not even drive onto a school parking lot. So yeah, even every 2 years for some instructors and every 5 years for some license holders may not be often enough to "get it right".

[longtooth]

The class is worth it to go.
I wont ever skip one.

[PaulTX]

I see the points about taking the class every 5 years. Although I missed the 3rd/5th renewal thing, I keep up with the CHL laws by reading.

Paul

[longtooth]

Most CHL holders dont spend as much time as activest as we do.

[Purplehood]

I forget. What does CHL stand for?

[HankB]

The classes are very nearly worthless, especially on renewal.

As far as I'm concerned, they're designed more to test one's capacity to exercise patience rather than anything else . . .

[Crossfire]

The classes are very nearly worthless, especially on renewal.

As far as I'm concerned, they're designed more to test one's capacity to exercise patience rather than anything else . . .

WOW

You have been going to the WRONG classes.

[HankB]

The classes are very nearly worthless, especially on renewal.

As far as I'm concerned, they're designed more to test one's capacity to exercise patience rather than anything else . . .

WOW

You have been going to the WRONG classes.

First class was with Ross Bransford. He really knew his stuff, and was incredibly patient - even with a woman who showed up with a loaded pistol (her husband's) and had NO idea of how it worked. Only real problem is that the Pflugerville cop he had taking prints didn't get useful ones, I had to have them redone at DPS.

First renewal was with Tom Schaeffer. He basically stood in front of the class and talked. His class also ran several hours longer than it had to. (The prints he took didn't work out, either.) Was a bit annoyed that he let his kid try to sell us stuff during the breaks. I really didn't get much out of this class.

Second renewal was with Austin Regional Firearms Academy - I posted a review here: http://www.texasshooting.com/TexasCHL_F ... ms#p200208" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

As long as one has to go to another class, the 2nd renewal class was better than the 1st renewal class.

[Mike1951]

The classes are very nearly worthless, especially on renewal.

As far as I'm concerned, they're designed more to test one's capacity to exercise patience rather than anything else . . .

WOW

You have been going to the WRONG classes.

I have to agree with HankB. After the original class and three renewals, they were all a waste of time.

They were all with different instructors, but they all made errors of some sort.

I learned far more by reading the handbook than any of the instructors ever taught.

I look forward to skipping the next joke of a class.

[boomerang]

I'm sure we've all heard plenty of stories of instructors teaching their opinion instead of the law. We probably know of instructors who show some generic gun videos during class when they could have used that time to talk about the law, or nonviolent dispute resolution, or other things that are supposed to be taught. We frequently see basic law questions on TexasCHLforum.com that should have been covered in class. Forum members have reported knowing more about the law than their instructors, thanks to discussions here. I even know of one instructor who had a PAC question on his test and told the students the answer instead of teaching about the transactional analysis model.

No offense to the competent instructors here but is it any wonder many people don't see the benefit of spending time and money for a renewal class?

[Charles L. Cotton]

My biggest concern about renewal classes is not being able to cover use of force/deadly force in the same depth I can in the initial 10 hr. class. There just isn't enough time in a 4 hr. class, especially if you have a good number of people and spend a good bit of time on the range. I try to encourage people to come to a free Texas Self-Defense & Deadly Force Seminar to get the rest of the story as Paul Harvey used to say but only a small percentage do.

I think the course should be reduced to use of force/deadly force and the off-limits areas. The non-violent dispute resolution material is actually pretty good; much better than we originally thought when CHL first passed and we laughed at the idea. Nevertheless, we should spend the students' time on the meat and potatoes of the issue; i.e. where you can and can't carry and when you can use force/deadly force.

I know I'm in the minority here, but the range portion of the class is virtually worthless and should be deleted. I've had very few people fail it on the first attempt and every one of them passed easily on the re-shoot. It is far more show than substance, however we might lose reciprocity with some states that require a shooting segment in the training.

Chas.

P.S.: The few people that had to re-shoot were all women and every time the problem was the wrong gun for the person. The men in their lives thought ladies need small guns and didn't consider the recoil. We gave them bigger guns to use and they passed easily.

[ELB]

I think the course should be reduced to use of force/deadly force and the off-limits areas. ... where you can and can't carry and when you can use force/deadly force.

DITTO.

I know I'm in the minority here, but the range portion of the class is virtually worthless and should be deleted.

DITTO DITTO.

...however we might lose reciprocity with some states that require a shooting segment in the training.

So maybe we can reduce the round count to six, at three yards? Yannow, average gun fight count and distance?