Worst LTC Student?

[mojo84]

Mojo, while I am a LTC instructor, as a Constitutionalist I see the right of self defense as being enshrined as a right which does not require the government's permission. Hopefully we will one day have Constitutional carry in Texas. That will take away some of my income, but my income is not as important to me as my freedom is.
Remember, a license is nothing more than the government taking away a right, then selling it back to you under the government's conditions.

Why is that addressed to me? Do you think I believe we should have to have a qualification, class or license to carry?

However, the reality is, that is exactly what we have. Based on the stats, it has been very effective in accomplishing what it was designed to accomplish. Until we can, if possible, eliminate the current process and requirements, I don't see how threads like this are complimetary to the pro-gun and pro-carry causes, especially when some of the claims are so outlandish.

[RossA]

To me, there is no pro-gun or pro-carry. It is all just a part of pro-freedom. There is no such thing as "gun rights", there are individual rights. To some it is a gun issue. To me it is a freedom issue.

[bblhd672]

It would be a good thing for ranges and gun shops to offer a free one hour orientation class to anyone buying a gun. I'll bet a lot of instructors would volunteer a couple of hours each month to teach such classes. I would.
Wish I owned my own darn range.

Fathers and mothers teach sons and daughters, relatives teach relatives, friends teach friends, neighbors teach neighbors.

[mojo84]

To me, there is no pro-gun or pro-carry. It is all just a part of pro-freedom. There is no such thing as "gun rights", there are individual rights. To some it is a gun issue. To me it is a freedom issue.

Whatever.

That's way beyond the topic of this thread. I'm sure not going to get into a manufactured argument over semantics when we pretty much agree on the big picture.

It's also your right to advance the pro-gun and pro-carry causes (freedom) by donating your time to give free lessons. Why not get on with it rather than just wishing others did it. Why make money on helping people enjoy a basic individual freedom by getting their LTC? You don't have to charge for your lessons? Kind of crazy to profit from helping someone enjoy a basic right. See how we can get mired in the mud when chasing rabbits?

[rtschl]

I borrowed a friends gun for my class as I was still trying to decide what I wanted to buy.

TAM, one problem I see is that it was the case that almost EVERYONE or every family had a gun and taught their kids. Daniel Boone had his first rifle around age 12 according to different biographies and was hunting alone. A lot of people only know what they see on TV/Movies:

Hollywood almost never assumes weapon is loaded - always racking the slide even multiple times because it sounds cool
Hollywood almost always is pointing weapon at something or someone they don't intend to destroy
Hollywood almost always shows the finger on the trigger
Hollywood never knows what is behind the intended target

It's no wonder we have multiple generations that are completely ignorant on the most basic safety rules.

[RossA]

"I'm sure not going to get into a manufactured argument over semantics when we pretty much agree on the big picture."

What some call semantics, others see as facts.

"It's also your right to advance the pro-gun and pro-carry causes (freedom) by donating your time to give free lessons. Why not get on with it rather than just wishing others did it."

Do you have any idea of how many free classes and neighborhood gun safety seminars I have done? I doubt it.

"Why make money on helping people enjoy a basic individual freedom by getting their LTC? You don't have to charge for your lessons? Kind of crazy to profit from helping someone enjoy a basic right."

In case you don't know anything about LTC classes, it costs money to teach them, so I charge enough to at least break even.

"See how we can get mired in the mud when chasing rabbits?"

You chase rabbits, I continue to chase liberty as I have always done.

[mojo84]

Are pro-gun and pro-carry causes and issues not components of Liberty?

To my point. Do threads like this one advance Liberty and freedom beyond someone exercising their right to free speech?

[bblhd672]

I'd venture to say the worst LTC student has not yet taken the course - the one whose incompetence kills an instructor and/or students or himself.

Let's just all agree that caution and safety must be observed at all times by everyone involved.

Oh, and no texting while shooting!

[Jusme]

I get a lot of questions about LTC, the process, the range qualifications, the classroom etc. I am not an LTC instructor, but I give honest answers as a former student. I tell everyone that the class, and range qualifications were not difficult, for me but that I do have an extensive background with both firearms and law enforcement. I tell everyone that they need to gain proficiency with their gun(s) before taking the class. I emphasize that the, LTC instructor, will not train them on handling firearms or shooting, and that they need to find a local basic firearms course before taking the class, otherwise they will not only face unnecessary stress with trying to " learn on the fly" but will be unsafe to themselves and others.
I was fortunate there were no students in the classroom, who weren't proficient enough to be able to safely handle their guns, but the instructor told some horror stories during the safety lecture, to demonstrate the type of things that would cause someone to be removed from the range.

Again, I don't believe that there should be any more requirements to obtain an LTC, than are already in place, but I think that the uninitiated, should be made very aware of the fact that taking an LTC class will not train them on how to safely operate, or effectively shoot their gun.

[Flightmare]

I get a lot of questions about LTC, the process, the range qualifications, the classroom etc. I am not an LTC instructor, but I give honest answers as a former student. I tell everyone that the class, and range qualifications were not difficult, for me but that I do have an extensive background with both firearms and law enforcement. I tell everyone that they need to gain proficiency with their gun(s) before taking the class. I emphasize that the, LTC instructor, will not train them on handling firearms or shooting, and that they need to find a local basic firearms course before taking the class, otherwise they will not only face unnecessary stress with trying to " learn on the fly" but will be unsafe to themselves and others.
I was fortunate there were no students in the classroom, who weren't proficient enough to be able to safely handle their guns, but the instructor told some horror stories during the safety lecture, to demonstrate the type of things that would cause someone to be removed from the range.

Again, I don't believe that there should be any more requirements to obtain an LTC, than are already in place, but I think that the uninitiated, should be made very aware of the fact that taking an LTC class will not train them on how to safely operate, or effectively shoot their gun.

This, right there! 100% agree!

[ajamacus]

Hi everybody,
I am an instructor in the Dallas area, teaching a few years. And I totally agree with having basic pistol instruction before taking my class. And if and when they passed the course, if I'm not comfortable with their skill level, I schedule a 3 hour session (and charge them) before I give them their certificate. It's only the right thing to do, in my opinion.

Someone had mentioned in a previous post about inserting the magazine in backwards, then having a round in the chamber in reverse. Either I'm dumb, but that is literally impossible to do. I can understand trying to put the magazine in backwards (which I've never seen successfully done--ever!), but a round in the chamber? It ain't happening.

[mojo84]

managed to get a round chambered that way

I would like more details on how he accomplished this? To my knowledge, it's impossible without major alterations to the cartridge or chamber?

Sounds pretty outlandish too me.

[Flightmare]

managed to get a round chambered that way

I would like more details on how he accomplished this? To my knowledge, it's impossible without major alterations to the cartridge or chamber?

Sounds pretty outlandish too me.

The RSO was surprised it was possible as well. Said he had never seen that happen before. I'm not 100% sure, but I think he said it was a .40 and he FORCED the slide to close.

[jmorris]

Hi everybody,
I am an instructor in the Dallas area, teaching a few years. And I totally agree with having basic pistol instruction before taking my class. And if and when they passed the course, if I'm not comfortable with their skill level, I schedule a 3 hour session (and charge them) before I give them their certificate. It's only the right thing to do, in my opinion.
............

You may feel it's the right thing to do but if they have passed both the written and proficiency tests I don't see that you have any legal right to withhold the certificate.

[Charles L. Cotton]

Hi everybody,
I am an instructor in the Dallas area, teaching a few years. And I totally agree with having basic pistol instruction before taking my class. And if and when they passed the course, if I'm not comfortable with their skill level, I schedule a 3 hour session (and charge them) before I give them their certificate. It's only the right thing to do, in my opinion.

Someone had mentioned in a previous post about inserting the magazine in backwards, then having a round in the chamber in reverse. Either I'm dumb, but that is literally impossible to do. I can understand trying to put the magazine in backwards (which I've never seen successfully done--ever!), but a round in the chamber? It ain't happening.

If you require a person to take an additional class before issuing a CHL-100 to a student who passed the course, then you are setting yourself up for a DTPA lawsuit. You may also hear from the DPS. As instructors, we cannot add to the requirements to obtain an LTC that are established by Texas law and DPS regulations.

Chas.