TXPeaceOfficerDave wrote:Remember. There are some places you buy weapons that are REQUIRED BY LAW to run your NICS check REGARDLESS OF YOUR STATUS AS AN LTC HOLDER!!! Let me give you one. AAFES at Randolph AFB right here in Universal City, TX. They do NOT recognize the Texas LTC and they run NICS no matter what. In fact, when you buy a weapon there you must fill out about three times the moral ATF paperwork and also register with base commander paperwork. Not joking. If you think I am wrong you're more than welcome to please go there and attempt to purchase for yourself. :-)
Thanks for the heads up. I will just continue to purchase from those who do recognize my LTC and speed up the process.
Take away the Second first, and the First is gone in a second
TXPeaceOfficerDave wrote:Remember. There are some places you buy weapons that are REQUIRED BY LAW to run your NICS check REGARDLESS OF YOUR STATUS AS AN LTC HOLDER!!! Let me give you one. AAFES at Randolph AFB right here in Universal City, TX. They do NOT recognize the Texas LTC and they run NICS no matter what. In fact, when you buy a weapon there you must fill out about three times the moral ATF paperwork and also register with base commander paperwork. Not joking. If you think I am wrong you're more than welcome to please go there and attempt to purchase for yourself. :-)
Solution, don't buy from AAFES. Go to your local gun shop...unless the prices are so much better. They didn't sell guns in the Navy Exchange when I was in the Navy, but I would have bought them "outside the fence" anyway. Personally, I will not do business with a shop that runs a NICS when they don't have to, but I understand that they have that option, just like I have the option not to buy from them. My latest purchase was private face to face in a mall parking lot...
4/13/1996 Completed CHL Class, 4/16/1996 Fingerprints, Affidavits, and Application Mailed, 10/4/1996 Received CHL, renewed 1998, 2002, 2006, 2011, 2016...). "ATF... Uhhh...heh...heh....Alcohol, tobacco, and GUNS!! Cool!!!!"
TXPeaceOfficerDave wrote:I only bought one weapon from AAFES cause they had the exact one I wanted at a darn good price and zero tax. I mean a really good price!!!
Do they sell handguns at AAFES?
4/13/1996 Completed CHL Class, 4/16/1996 Fingerprints, Affidavits, and Application Mailed, 10/4/1996 Received CHL, renewed 1998, 2002, 2006, 2011, 2016...). "ATF... Uhhh...heh...heh....Alcohol, tobacco, and GUNS!! Cool!!!!"
Yes, they do. In fact, they can even order special stuff as long as their distributor can get it
Handguns. Yes
Long guns. Yes
Please remember that AAFES, the MCX and the Navy Exchange operate on the regional weapons ordering system. Which means they use one of the stores in each major city to carry weapons. Basically if you live near San Antonio you must go to Randolph AFB to order and can't get at other city bases.
TXPeaceOfficerDave wrote:Remember. There are some places you buy weapons that are REQUIRED BY LAW to run your NICS check REGARDLESS OF YOUR STATUS AS AN LTC HOLDER!!! Let me give you one. AAFES at Randolph AFB right here in Universal City, TX. They do NOT recognize the Texas LTC and they run NICS no matter what. In fact, when you buy a weapon there you must fill out about three times the moral ATF paperwork and also register with base commander paperwork. Not joking. If you think I am wrong you're more than welcome to please go there and attempt to purchase for yourself. :-)
There is no Texas law requiring it, since AAFES is federal they may have some mandated. What law requires it? I'm curious.
Sure. Easy enough. Called administrative law. Under federal AAFES administrative law and under th lawful order of a commanding commissioned officer AAFES is required to do NICS
The AAFES is actually a military organization run out of Dallas TX. AAFES has both a civilian oversight and military commander at the exact same time. The commander is a two star general and he has orders that all military sales around the world that sell firearms to do an NICS, regardless of state law in which the facility operated. Now, could they use a law known as the Assimilative Crimes Act and then assimilate state law into the base? Answer is YES. but unfortunately the commander has not done that. In fact, he gave a direct order to all subordinate units on any military instillation to go in the opposite direction. No matter who you are you must do the NICS. And if you are a civilian off base ou chasing at an off base gun shop and you want to do an FFL transfer with AAFES because they have your gun, the transfer MUST have an NICS check attached. Not joking.
TXPeaceOfficerDave wrote:Sure. Easy enough. Called administrative law. Under federal AAFES administrative law and under th lawful order of a commanding commissioned officer AAFES is required to do NICS
The AAFES is actually a military organization run out of Dallas TX. AAFES has both a civilian oversight and military commander at the exact same time. The commander is a two star general and he has orders that all military sales around the world that sell firearms to do an NICS, regardless of state law in which the facility operated. Now, could they use a law known as the Assimilative Crimes Act and then assimilate state law into the base? Answer is YES. but unfortunately the commander has not done that. In fact, he gave a direct order to all subordinate units on any military instillation to go in the opposite direction. No matter who you are you must do the NICS. And if you are a civilian off base ou chasing at an off base gun shop and you want to do an FFL transfer with AAFES because they have your gun, the transfer MUST have an NICS check attached. Not joking.
Since paperwork is generally done on the receiving end, once the weapon has already been received by the FFL...how does the AAFES regulate how that privately owned entity conducts business. Not saying they don't but just curious as to how that is accepted and not considered an overreach of their authority.
"I can see it's dangerous for you, but if the government trusts me, maybe you could."
They do it by refusing to release any weapon outside the store unless an NICS is attached.
Get this one. They are so much on the far end of the spectrum that it is government policy that they will not sell you ammo on the same day to anyone in your party or household on the same day you purchase a weapon.
At Camp Bullis when they open deer hunting on the ranges each year you must register all weapons and even have "lawful" calipers you're allowed to hunt with. Any deviation and you're kicked off base with active duty troops prosecuted under the UCMJ. No play here. They are dead serious.
In fact, have heard rumors at the base legal office they are considering a mandate that ALL PERSONAL OWNED WEAPONS EITHER ON OR OFF BASE LIVKNG ACTIVE DUTY PERSONNEL must be stored in the base armory.
Before you scream about that being unconstitutional I agree. But trust me. Army is seriously considering it because of the Hassan Nidal case.
TXPeaceOfficerDave wrote:Sure. Easy enough. Called administrative law. Under federal AAFES administrative law and under th lawful order of a commanding commissioned officer AAFES is required to do NICS
The AAFES is actually a military organization run out of Dallas TX. AAFES has both a civilian oversight and military commander at the exact same time. The commander is a two star general and he has orders that all military sales around the world that sell firearms to do an NICS, regardless of state law in which the facility operated. Now, could they use a law known as the Assimilative Crimes Act and then assimilate state law into the base? Answer is YES. but unfortunately the commander has not done that. In fact, he gave a direct order to all subordinate units on any military instillation to go in the opposite direction. No matter who you are you must do the NICS. And if you are a civilian off base ou chasing at an off base gun shop and you want to do an FFL transfer with AAFES because they have your gun, the transfer MUST have an NICS check attached. Not joking.
You're essentially saying that DoD Regulations require it. Those regulations must be authorized by an enabling statute, and no doubt they are...In title 10 USC it says military personnel have to obey the lawful orders of those officers appointed above them...So that covers AAFES being required to run a NICS, but it doesn't make it illegal for the downstream private FFL dealer to sell it without one. It may be illegal for someone subject to UCMJ to bypass, but AAFES FFL transferring to private FFL, to non-military person, has no legal authority to require NICS. With the recent move to open AAFES to all honorably discharged veterans, this issue may soon come up.
4/13/1996 Completed CHL Class, 4/16/1996 Fingerprints, Affidavits, and Application Mailed, 10/4/1996 Received CHL, renewed 1998, 2002, 2006, 2011, 2016...). "ATF... Uhhh...heh...heh....Alcohol, tobacco, and GUNS!! Cool!!!!"
TXPeaceOfficerDave wrote:I completely agree it's an overreach. No doubt.
They do it by refusing to release any weapon outside the store unless an NICS is attached.
Get this one. They are so much on the far end of the spectrum that it is government policy that they will not sell you ammo on the same day to anyone in your party or household on the same day you purchase a weapon.
At Camp Bullis when they open deer hunting on the ranges each year you must register all weapons and even have "lawful" calipers you're allowed to hunt with. Any deviation and you're kicked off base with active duty troops prosecuted under the UCMJ. No play here. They are dead serious.
In fact, have heard rumors at the base legal office they are considering a mandate that ALL PERSONAL OWNED WEAPONS EITHER ON OR OFF BASE LIVKNG ACTIVE DUTY PERSONNEL must be stored in the base armory.
Before you scream about that being unconstitutional I agree. But trust me. Army is seriously considering it because of the Hassan Nidal case.
I could easily see them do this, at least with this administration or Hillary's pending administration. I also could see it being quietly but routinely ignored by many military. I'm not advocating doing this (in violation forum rule 4 ), but making a supposition based on my knowledge of military personnel.
ETA: I can also see a lot of military spouses living off base acquiring large collections from their significant others...
Last edited by ScottDLS on Thu Aug 25, 2016 10:36 am, edited 1 time in total.
4/13/1996 Completed CHL Class, 4/16/1996 Fingerprints, Affidavits, and Application Mailed, 10/4/1996 Received CHL, renewed 1998, 2002, 2006, 2011, 2016...). "ATF... Uhhh...heh...heh....Alcohol, tobacco, and GUNS!! Cool!!!!"
TXPeaceOfficerDave wrote:In fact, have heard rumors at the base legal office they are considering a mandate that ALL PERSONAL OWNED WEAPONS EITHER ON OR OFF BASE LIVKNG ACTIVE DUTY PERSONNEL must be stored in the base armory.
Before you scream about that being unconstitutional I agree. But trust me. Army is seriously considering it because of the Hassan Nidal case.
I can see that they could FORCE their soldiers to comply with that nonsense, but their significant others, especially off base....not so much. Couldn't you just transfer weapons to significant other and be done?
"I can see it's dangerous for you, but if the government trusts me, maybe you could."
The clarify. They can't make it "illegal" in requiring an NICS check along with civilian transfers, then can simply just refuse to do the transfer and that is exactly their policy.
You go online and find a gun you want at your local
Gun store. The gun store is off base. But the gun is in the ring caliber that you wanted. But AAFES has the gun in the right caliber. Since you live so far awa you decide to do an FFL transfer with your local gun shop with AAFES.
AAFES will refuse the transfer unless they know who is vying the gun and who bought said gun has an NICS check.
TXPeaceOfficerDave wrote:In fact, have heard rumors at the base legal office they are considering a mandate that ALL PERSONAL OWNED WEAPONS EITHER ON OR OFF BASE LIVKNG ACTIVE DUTY PERSONNEL must be stored in the base armory.
Before you scream about that being unconstitutional I agree. But trust me. Army is seriously considering it because of the Hassan Nidal case.
I can see that they could FORCE their soldiers to comply with that nonsense, but their significant others, especially off base....not so much. Couldn't you just transfer weapons to significant other and be done?
How do they know what weapons off base personnel own? I'm not ex-military so I am unfamiliar with the regs, but unless they have a registry of firearms, how do they know who has what?
Take away the Second first, and the First is gone in a second
And believe it or not the military commander CAN issue local orders and directives on base that the civilians and dependents also must follow. The base wing commander has LOTS AND LOTS of power when it comes to guns on base.
A good friend of mine is a San Antonio police officer and he is also the Security Forces commander at Randolph for the reserve units. He is a major and went to the academy with me. Good buddy of mine. When he goes on base for his duty weekend he gets stopped UN HIS SAPD PATROL VEHICLE at the gates and can't even leave his duty gear in his car at the base unit. He carries his weapon cause got an exemption letter from the wing commander. They take things way way way over the top.
), but making a supposition based on my knowledge of military personnel.
