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Is there a requirement for you to bring your original tax stamp to the range when shooting a suppressor, SBR, or other NFA item? Today is the second time I've been told by a friend that they were turned away from a range because they only had a copy of their paperwork. My gun range has never asked me for the tax stamp or even a copy of it. I have copies in my range bag and one on my phone. Original is in the safe tucked away for safe keeping.

Obviously their range = their rules. I get it. But am I missing something? One range said that you could go to jail if you didn't have the original tax stamp in your possession at the range.

azwe wrote:Is there a requirement for you to bring your original tax stamp to the range when shooting a suppressor, SBR, or other NFA item? Today is the second time I've been told by a friend that they were turned away from a range because they only had a copy of their paperwork. My gun range has never asked me for the tax stamp or even a copy of it. I have copies in my range bag and one on my phone. Original is in the safe tucked away for safe keeping.

Obviously their range = their rules. I get it. But am I missing something? One range said that you could go to jail if you didn't have the original tax stamp in your possession at the range.

No way my originals stay locked in the safe. I made color copies that are hard to tell from original. Find a new range.

azwe wrote:Is there a requirement for you to bring your original tax stamp to the range when shooting a suppressor, SBR, or other NFA item? Today is the second time I've been told by a friend that they were turned away from a range because they only had a copy of their paperwork. My gun range has never asked me for the tax stamp or even a copy of it. I have copies in my range bag and one on my phone. Original is in the safe tucked away for safe keeping.

Obviously their range = their rules. I get it. But am I missing something? One range said that you could go to jail if you didn't have the original tax stamp in your possession at the range.

Must be a new trend. Just yesterday, I went to Shoot Point Blank in North Richland Hills for the first time, to try out my new pistol suppressor. At the register before entering the range, they asked me if I needed to rent any guns, and I said, no I brought my own and was just there to try out a new suppressor. Nobody cared.

Later, while at my shooting lane, the RSO came over to me, and asked me if this was my first time there, to which I said yes. Then he said, “do you have a stamp for that thing?” I said yes, and he asked me to produce it. I was shocked.....nobody has ever done that to me before, but I had paid for my hour of shooting, and wanted to get back at it without getting into an argument by telling him to go pound sand. So I got the copy out of my case and showed it to him, he thanked me, and I went back to shooting.

A couple of lanes over, there were two guys shooting several handguns and a 9mm SBR - all suppressed. One of them was apparently a Glock employee, which I discovered as we chatted briefly. After the RSO left, the Glock guy came over to me and asked incredulously, “did he just ask you to show your stamp?” When I said yes, he asked “what the heck for?” I said it beat the crap out of me, but that I complied so that I could get it over with and get back to shooting. He said, “that’s bovine manure!” To which I agreed. Nobody had asked him to produce his stamps.

On Monday, I will be sending an email to their management.

The dirty secret is that nearly all Americans own highly effective, 2-3 use disposable suppressors. Watch the Jerry Miculek video on using a "field expedient pillow suppressor". A criminal sophisticated enough to care about disguising the sound of his gun shot would have no trouble procuring a unregistered pillow.

The Annoyed Man wrote:

azwe wrote:Is there a requirement for you to bring your original tax stamp to the range when shooting a suppressor, SBR, or other NFA item? Today is the second time I've been told by a friend that they were turned away from a range because they only had a copy of their paperwork. My gun range has never asked me for the tax stamp or even a copy of it. I have copies in my range bag and one on my phone. Original is in the safe tucked away for safe keeping.

Obviously their range = their rules. I get it. But am I missing something? One range said that you could go to jail if you didn't have the original tax stamp in your possession at the range.

Must be a new trend. Just yesterday, I went to Shoot Point Blank in North Richland Hills for the first time, to try out my new pistol suppressor. At the register before entering the range, they asked me if I needed to rent any guns, and I said, no I brought my own and was just there to try out a new suppressor. Nobody cared.

Later, while at my shooting lane, the RSO came over to me, and asked me if this was my first time there, to which I said yes. Then he said, “do you have a stamp for that thing?” I said yes, and he asked me to produce it. I was shocked.....nobody has ever done that to me before, but I had paid for my hour of shooting, and wanted to get back at it without getting into an argument by telling him to go pound sand. So I got the copy out of my case and showed it to him, he thanked me, and I went back to shooting.

A couple of lanes over, there were two guys shooting several handguns and a 9mm SBR - all suppressed. One of them was apparently a Glock employee, which I discovered as we chatted briefly. After the RSO left, the Glock guy came over to me and asked incredulously, “did he just ask you to show your stamp?” When I said yes, he asked “what the heck for?” I said it beat the crap out of me, but that I complied so that I could get it over with and get back to shooting. He said, “that’s bovine manure!” To which I agreed. Nobody had asked him to produce his stamps.

On Monday, I will be sending an email to their management.

Chris, that is the policy at ShootPointBlank, it's in the range rules that you signed when you bought the waiver. I was teaching the LTC class last night but saw Dave T. come in with his Glock Gen5 shirt on and said hey. Didn't know he was shooting any NFA items. I would have said Hi if I would have seen you also. But the RSO should have asked him too, even though it may have annoyed him. But it's really not a big deal (at least to me) I always carry my Form 4 copies with me for the items I have. Go ahead and write to managment - they won't change it. Just the policy set by Tom the owner in Ohio. Just like the requirement that we as employees have to carry IWB, no OWB carry. I don't like it either, but if I want to work there, I live with it.

I think our range is pretty cool, RSOs are generally not annoying - I know I'm not when I'm on duty Clean, big and well lit.

James

extremist wrote:
Chris, that is the policy at ShootPointBlank, it's in the range rules that you signed when you bought the waiver. I was teaching the LTC class last night but saw Dave T. come in with his Glock Gen5 shirt on and said hey. Didn't know he was shooting any NFA items. I would have said Hi if I would have seen you also. But the RSO should have asked him too, even though it may have annoyed him. But it's really not a big deal (at least to me) I always carry my Form 4 copies with me for the items I have. Go ahead and write to managment - they won't change it. Just the policy set by Tom the owner in Ohio. Just like the requirement that we as employees have to carry IWB, no OWB carry. I don't like it either, but if I want to work there, I live with it.

I think our range is pretty cool, RSOs are generally not annoying - I know I'm not when I'm on duty Clean, big and well lit.

James

Rules are rules but you mind telling me why? I refuse to go to a range that requires me to bring my original stamp.

azwe wrote:

extremist wrote:
Chris, that is the policy at ShootPointBlank, it's in the range rules that you signed when you bought the waiver. I was teaching the LTC class last night but saw Dave T. come in with his Glock Gen5 shirt on and said hey. Didn't know he was shooting any NFA items. I would have said Hi if I would have seen you also. But the RSO should have asked him too, even though it may have annoyed him. But it's really not a big deal (at least to me) I always carry my Form 4 copies with me for the items I have. Go ahead and write to managment - they won't change it. Just the policy set by Tom the owner in Ohio. Just like the requirement that we as employees have to carry IWB, no OWB carry. I don't like it either, but if I want to work there, I live with it.

I think our range is pretty cool, RSOs are generally not annoying - I know I'm not when I'm on duty Clean, big and well lit.

James

Rules are rules but you mind telling me why? I refuse to go to a range that requires me to bring my original stamp.

No Sir, I did not say that the original is required - not at ShootPointBlank. Photocopies are fine.

I would never carry around my original Form 4.

James

extremist wrote:

The Annoyed Man wrote:

azwe wrote:Is there a requirement for you to bring your original tax stamp to the range when shooting a suppressor, SBR, or other NFA item? Today is the second time I've been told by a friend that they were turned away from a range because they only had a copy of their paperwork. My gun range has never asked me for the tax stamp or even a copy of it. I have copies in my range bag and one on my phone. Original is in the safe tucked away for safe keeping.

Obviously their range = their rules. I get it. But am I missing something? One range said that you could go to jail if you didn't have the original tax stamp in your possession at the range.

Must be a new trend. Just yesterday, I went to Shoot Point Blank in North Richland Hills for the first time, to try out my new pistol suppressor. At the register before entering the range, they asked me if I needed to rent any guns, and I said, no I brought my own and was just there to try out a new suppressor. Nobody cared.

Later, while at my shooting lane, the RSO came over to me, and asked me if this was my first time there, to which I said yes. Then he said, “do you have a stamp for that thing?” I said yes, and he asked me to produce it. I was shocked.....nobody has ever done that to me before, but I had paid for my hour of shooting, and wanted to get back at it without getting into an argument by telling him to go pound sand. So I got the copy out of my case and showed it to him, he thanked me, and I went back to shooting.

A couple of lanes over, there were two guys shooting several handguns and a 9mm SBR - all suppressed. One of them was apparently a Glock employee, which I discovered as we chatted briefly. After the RSO left, the Glock guy came over to me and asked incredulously, “did he just ask you to show your stamp?” When I said yes, he asked “what the heck for?” I said it beat the crap out of me, but that I complied so that I could get it over with and get back to shooting. He said, “that’s bovine manure!” To which I agreed. Nobody had asked him to produce his stamps.

On Monday, I will be sending an email to their management.

Chris, that is the policy at ShootPointBlank, it's in the range rules that you signed when you bought the waiver. I was teaching the LTC class last night but saw Dave T. come in with his Glock Gen5 shirt on and said hey. Didn't know he was shooting any NFA items. I would have said Hi if I would have seen you also. But the RSO should have asked him too, even though it may have annoyed him. But it's really not a big deal (at least to me) I always carry my Form 4 copies with me for the items I have. Go ahead and write to managment - they won't change it. Just the policy set by Tom the owner in Ohio. Just like the requirement that we as employees have to carry IWB, no OWB carry. I don't like it either, but if I want to work there, I live with it.

I think our range is pretty cool, RSOs are generally not annoying - I know I'm not when I'm on duty Clean, big and well lit.

James

Well, his property, his rules, but he has no more logical reason to demand to see a stamp than he has to demand that the shooter prove he is lawfully in possession of the guns he brought with him. That is the proper purview of law enforcement, and nobody else.

I won’t be back.

What may (or possibly not) amount to piddling Pro-forma rule enforcement really annoy the living daylights out of me / petty tyrants love em & really enjoy enforcing them. Of course, they may (given em the benefit of the doubt) may be required by management for all their RSO's to go through this tiresome effort... - as someone mentioned earlier, their range...their rules.

First, after making it an absolute certainty they're correct in their demands. (perhaps they are, if so, so be it...) but, if they're in the wrong...

And if it turns out they're just being difficult with suppressed gun shooters, due to an over abundance of misguided caution, I'd go out of my way to communicate this factoid to one and all of my gun shooting friends and avoid them like the plague in the future....

So, as it turns out, the policy is homegrown...not mandated by law...mandated by the owner.

This is the kind of customer restraint that slowly kills businesses...

Word will get out, customer base will gradually decline as petty autocracy is especially frowned on in Texas.

Buh-bye business...

I’ve read on other sites today that this is not uncommon - supposed to protect the range owners should ATF come to the range and check tax stamps of shooters present with NFA items. Prevent ranges for being charged with allowing illegal firearms.
Whether or not that is an actual ATF regulation or a range rule recommended by attorneys I don’t know.

Wish the Hearing Protection Act would get passed and put end to the suppressor foolishness.

Abraham wrote:So, as it turns out, the policy is homegrown...not mandated by law...mandated by the owner.

This is the kind of customer restraint that slowly kills businesses...

Word will get out, customer base will gradually decline as petty autocracy is especially frowned on in Texas.

Buh-bye business...

No, not really, the ratio of annoyed Form 4 possessors to the number of regular and new shooters that come to the range is probably over 100:1.

You can choose to be annoyed, or you can choose to come shoot and have fun.



James

bblhd672,

Not fussing at you at all, but regarding TAM's observation: "Well, his property, his rules, but he has no more logical reason to demand to see a stamp than he has to demand that the shooter prove he is lawfully in possession of the guns he brought with him.

May I add to that, what's to stop him (the owner, not the RSO who's mandated by the owner) from wanting to see proof of...anything? Perhaps, he'd like to perform an on the spot urine drug test? Ok, I'm going over the top, (on purpose to make a point) but being an owner doesn't empower the owner L.E. officialdom...or does it? If it does, I sure wouldn't go there.

His requirement/s don't pass the smell test.

Just because I pay my way to use his facilities doesn't create a serf/nobleman contract.

I am not his serf. He is not only NOT a nobleman, he's not law enforcement.

Perhaps, pretending to be L.E. entitles him to be served as one pretending to be one...

I don't have any stamps, but am considering getting one in the future, so please excuse my ignorance. Does it out the range owner in jeopordy, if an unstamped firearm is found being used by the ATF.? I understand that demanding t he original is overkill, but it doesn't seem like it's asking a lot to show their papers of it does indeed put the range owner at risk.

extremist wrote: Just like the requirement that we as employees have to carry IWB, no OWB carry.
James

My curiosity compels me to ask what's the rationale behind this one? Cosmetic uniformity, like all employees wearing a company logo shirt?