Air Pistols and Rifles

[Dannyboy]

Some discussion and questions about CO2 air pistols and rifles:

I bought a couple of air pistols that are very realistic looking - one looks like a Walther PPK, or Sig Sauer Compact P250. The resemblance is impressive, especially from 15 feet away.

Question: Can I carry this air pistol concealed? What about open carry?

Another question: Are these guns required to have the little red or orange plastic piece near the tip of the barrel to indicate it's an air gun?

The velocity on this piece is over 400 fps, not bad for an air gun, and when shooting the 177 caliber steel BBs, they can penetrate automobile metal, human skin, lots of things. It's my understanding I can shoot someone who is trespassing with intent to steal. Or if I catch someone trying to break into my vehicle, whether out on the street, or in the driveway, I can shoot them, right?

Thanks for any replies.

[Middle Age Russ]

Air guns are mostly designed and suitable for target practice, force-on-force (think AirSoft), and some small game applications. Though people have been seriously injured, and maybe even killed, by projectiles from an airgun, this is rare. An airgun is not something I'd consider as a force option of any kind against another person.

Regarding your questions:

If licensed, I don't see any reason why you couldn't carry an air pistol concealed or open, as appropriate. Why you would want to do so is a question back toward you, though. As mentioned a moment ago, air guns are typically not suitable for defensive purposes since they don't produce energies needed to cause significant tissue damage. If you pull a gun on someone (assuming as always that you'd only do that if you needed to RIGHT NOW to protect yourself or loved ones) you will definitely want to be able to inflict more injury on your attacker than an airgun can produce. I guess what I am saying is don't bring an airgun to a gunfight.

The red tips are required in certain states and/or municipal areas to the best of my knowledge. Check your local laws to be sure.

Shooting people for property crimes (even with an airgun) is getting into areas where I am not terribly comfortable. There are some circumstances where it is technically legal to use deadly force against someone committing a property crime in the state of Texas. You will likely be perceived to be using deadly force if you shoot someone with an airgun, and that can be cause for some serious repercussions. For example, if you employ an airgun against someone committing a property crime under circumstances that deadly force is not legal, you could be prosecuted. Also, if your perceived use of deadly force causes the criminal to produce their own firearm and shoot back you are suddenly in the middle of a gunfight without a reasonably good (for fighting) gun. Lives are one thing, and property is another. Most property is replaceable, and can be insured so real losses are not terribly significant. Use of force or deadly force should generally not be considered for property crimes for this reason.

[Jusme]

You mention that the airguns look very realistic and that is the reason so many people have been shot by LEOs while carrying one. I too have to question why you would choose to carry one. It is not a good defensive tool, it could definitely put you into a life or death situation, where you could come out on the losing end, and as Middle Age Russ stated, you would be under the same deadly force restrictions for its use as a firearm.

My advice is to use the air pistols for their designed use, target practice, maybe taking out pesky squirrels, teaching kids basic firearm safety etc. but not to deter would be thieves from breaking into your car.JMHO

[Wag2323]

:
You mention that the airguns look very realistic and that is the reason so many people have been shot by LEOs while carrying one.

This is the reason I would be careful about having a realistic airgun and doing anything in my front yard with it. I live in a neighborhood with my neighbors some mom would freak out and call the police if I was walking around with a realistic gun not in a holster (probably even if holstered lol).

If a LEO shows up and you don't have it holstered it is going to be a tense situation for him/her I imagine.

[Pariah3j]

I'm not sure using a airsoft/co2 pistol would rise to the level of deadly force. It would be more the category of less than lethal, more like a paintball marker or similar type of instrument.

Given that imho, that it doesn't rise to the level of being a firearm, I don't think you would need a permit to carry one. However I think as suggested before me, that would be ill advised and foolish due to the number of reasons that could go wrong.

[WildBill]

Some discussion and questions about CO2 air pistols and rifles:

I bought a couple of air pistols that are very realistic looking - one looks like a Walther PPK, or Sig Sauer Compact P250. The resemblance is impressive, especially from 15 feet away.

Question: Can I carry this air pistol concealed? What about open carry?

Another question: Are these guns required to have the little red or orange plastic piece near the tip of the barrel to indicate it's an air gun?

The velocity on this piece is over 400 fps, not bad for an air gun, and when shooting the 177 caliber steel BBs, they can penetrate automobile metal, human skin, lots of things. It's my understanding I can shoot someone who is trespassing with intent to steal. Or if I catch someone trying to break into my vehicle, whether out on the street, or in the driveway, I can shoot them, right?

Thanks for any replies.

Dannyboy - I agree with the others that carrying an air pistol in public is not wise. I don't know the legalities about it, but I can't see any upside to doing such a thing.
Maybe you can find a friendly CHL instructor who will let you audit their course so you can learn about the laws.

[WildBill]

I'm not sure using a airsoft/co2 pistol would rise to the level of deadly force. It would be more the category of less than lethal, more like a paintball marker or similar type of instrument.

Given that imho, that it doesn't rise to the level of being a firearm, I don't think you would need a permit to carry one. However I think as suggested before me, that would be ill advised and foolish due to the number of reasons that could go wrong.

It could. An air pistol could be considered a deadly weapon.

Texas Penal Code Sec. 1.07. DEFINITIONS.
17) "Deadly weapon" means:
(A) a firearm or anything manifestly designed, made, or adapted for the purpose of inflicting death or serious bodily injury; or
(B) anything that in the manner of its use or intended use is capable of causing death or serious bodily injury.

[Pariah3j]

I'm not sure using a airsoft/co2 pistol would rise to the level of deadly force. It would be more the category of less than lethal, more like a paintball marker or similar type of instrument.

Given that imho, that it doesn't rise to the level of being a firearm, I don't think you would need a permit to carry one. However I think as suggested before me, that would be ill advised and foolish due to the number of reasons that could go wrong.

It could. An air pistol could be considered a deadly weapon.

Texas Penal Code Sec. 1.07. DEFINITIONS.
17) "Deadly weapon" means:
(A) a firearm or anything manifestly designed, made, or adapted for the purpose of inflicting death or serious bodily injury; or
(B) anything that in the manner of its use or intended use is capable of causing death or serious bodily injury.

Yeah at 400fps it does not inflict death nor serious bodily injury.

Not sure if Texas has a different definition but I'm sure its close to:

The term “serious bodily injury” is defined in Section 1365(h)(3) of Title 18, U.S. Code, to mean a bodily injury that involves a substantial risk of death, extreme physical pain, protracted and obvious disfigurement, or protracted loss or impairment of the function of a bodily member, organ, or mental faculty.

The purpose of airsoft/co2 pistols are not for inflicting death or serious bodily injury and I think it would be a stretch that its use/intended use could be made to be that to cause death or serious bodily injury.

[WildBill]

I'm not sure using a airsoft/co2 pistol would rise to the level of deadly force. It would be more the category of less than lethal, more like a paintball marker or similar type of instrument.

Given that imho, that it doesn't rise to the level of being a firearm, I don't think you would need a permit to carry one. However I think as suggested before me, that would be ill advised and foolish due to the number of reasons that could go wrong.

It could. An air pistol could be considered a deadly weapon.

Texas Penal Code Sec. 1.07. DEFINITIONS.
17) "Deadly weapon" means:
(A) a firearm or anything manifestly designed, made, or adapted for the purpose of inflicting death or serious bodily injury; or
(B) anything that in the manner of its use or intended use is capable of causing death or serious bodily injury.

Yeah at 400fps it does not inflict death nor serious bodily injury.

Not sure if Texas has a different definition but I'm sure its close to:

The term “serious bodily injury” is defined in Section 1365(h)(3) of Title 18, U.S. Code, to mean a bodily injury that involves a substantial risk of death, extreme physical pain, protracted and obvious disfigurement, or protracted loss or impairment of the function of a bodily member, organ, or mental faculty.

The purpose of airsoft/co2 pistols are not for inflicting death or serious bodily injury and I think it would be a stretch that its use/intended use could be made to be that to cause death or serious bodily injury.

Read 17B. It says use or intended use. Pellet guns may not be purposed for inflicting death or serious bodily injury, but they can.
FYI a pellet gun/airgun is not synonymous with Airsoft. My comments are for pellet guns AKA airguns which are designed to fire a metal projectile.

http://www.indystar.com/story/news/crim ... h/3784679/

[Pariah3j]

I will concede that intended use could vary, of course I was speaking in reference to the topic presented by the OP. The question was about carrying one of the CO2 pistols was where my thinking was at- there is a world of difference that I've seen between the pistols he's talking about and the new age pellet rifles. Some of those new pellet rifles can be almost as powerful as a 22.

[rotor]

They are illegal to shoot in my community. Check your local laws.

[WildBill]

I will concede that intended use could vary, of course I was speaking in reference to the topic presented by the OP. The question was about carrying one of the CO2 pistols was where my thinking was at- there is a world of difference that I've seen between the pistols he's talking about and the new age pellet rifles. Some of those new pellet rifles can almost be as powerful as a 22.

I have an "old age" [30 years old] spring-powered pellet rifle that will fire a pellet 900 FPS. Also a rock can be a deadly weapon.

[Pariah3j]

I will concede that intended use could vary, of course I was speaking in reference to the topic presented by the OP. The question was about carrying one of the CO2 pistols was where my thinking was at- there is a world of difference that I've seen between the pistols he's talking about and the new age pellet rifles. Some of those new pellet rifles can almost be as powerful as a 22.

I have an "old age" [30 years old] spring-powered pellet rifle that will fire a pellet 900 FPS. Also a rock can be a deadly weapon.

True dat

[nedmoore]

I am surprised that anyone here on the forum took the time to respond to this question. Really? Open carry with a pellet gun?

What a waste of time and bandwidth.

[Jusme]

I am surprised that anyone here on the forum took the time to respond to this question. Really? Open carry with a pellet gun?

What a waste of time and bandwidth.

I've always said, there are no stupid questions, only stupid mistakes. The OP asked a question for which he wanted honest answers, No one was forced to respond, and I don't think anyone was disrespectful in their replies, If the OP didn't respect the views and opinions of the forum members he could have asked others not as experienced and gotten very bad advice. I will never rebuke someone for asking questions, no matter how common sense the answer may seem to me. There is a lot of bad advice and mis-information floating around out there that can and has gotten people hurt and/or killed, If I can express my opinion and possibly stem that tide, the bandwidth is not wasted.JMHO