April 11th class - Anyone going?

[TDDude]

Just got here myself from Houston.

Strange hotel, couple pistolas and couple hundred rounds of ammo and nothin to do.

Only in Texas!!

[sjfcontrol]

It's not that bad -- It's basically a 4-day long CHL class.

[KaiserB]

Oh the number of what if questions in the class .... oh the humanity ....

[Symtex]

I thought he wasnt going to answer the "What if" questions.

[MasterOfNone]

"But what if a guy is waving a pencil in a threatening manner? Can I shoot him then?"

[Art S]

Just checking on how class is going. I am scheduled for the April 25th class and wondering what to expect.
One other question when did you get your packet for class? I got notice by e-mail with forms to be filled out but no packet yet.
Any info would be helpful.

Art S

[KaiserB]

Just checking on how class is going. I am scheduled for the April 25th class and wondering what to expect.
One other question when did you get your packet for class? I got notice by e-mail with forms to be filled out but no packet yet.
Any info would be helpful.

Art S

You get all the info (packet) you need Day 1 of class

[Luggo1]

"But what if a guy is waving a pencil in a threatening manner? Can I shoot him then?"

+1 there seem to be a lot of eager beavers just dying to pull the trigger on someone...kinda disconcerting that these folks will instruct others....

[KaiserB]

"But what if a guy is waving a pencil in a threatening manner? Can I shoot him then?"

+1 there seem to be a lot of eager beavers just dying to pull the trigger on someone...kinda disconcerting that these folks will instruct others....

More concerning is the number of people NOT using common sense and asking "What if" regarding every permutation of a hypothetical situation. One person in the back of the room today was trying to discern the difference in theft vs. burglary regarding use of force for engaging criminals (shooting them) at night.

[TDDude]

For those attending, if the instructors/presenters indicate that something is new, please share it here. We'd all appreciate it.

Well, let me see if I can answer this one.

Since this is my first class, don't really know if anything is new. Doing everything online is really cool. CHL100 replaces the TR100 but I'm sure all you old timers know that already.

They really, REALLY, REALLY, don't want to see any paper forms sent in anymore. The same can be said for having to handle money. A credit card online is what they want. Having the applicant fill out forms online means no one at the DPS has to handle any mail and do any data entry. Successful background checks and license issue can take as little as three weeks. If stuff is missing or inaccurate it still takes awhile but not having to deal with mail and data entry takes weeks off the application time.

The 800 number is going away.

If the applicant is behind on child support but is keeping up current and back payments, being behind no longer qualifies as a condition for suspension. She wasn't clear on when that change happened but NOW, as long as the CHL holder is keeping current, the plastic is still good. Before, even if the holder was keeping current with the catch up payments, the plastic was suspended until everything was caught up. This interested me because I've hit a couple rough patches in the past and got behind and even though I was always making up the arrears, I never realized I could have been suspended.

With L-1 doing the prints and all the forms filled out online, the only service that could happen at the class would be passport photos. They are looking into having the L-1 picture also count as the passport photo but it’s not happening yet. The L-1 gear costs $14k I believe so having a gun range or individual teacher purchasing one isn’t really an option. L-1 is looking for partners to open up locations but only in areas that aren’t covered very well such as small towns. If applicants live out in the boonies, they are out of luck and will simply have to drive the hundred or so miles to a location. L-1 and DPS realize this is a problem but so far it has no solution. Paper print cards will not be accepted for any reason.

All the big law changes happened in '09.

I will say that after actually studying the statute on Tuesday evening, I never realized how many gray areas there are but hey, that's what keeps lawyers in business.

[troglodyte]

Well it looks like you'll be shooting in the morning. Good luck and enjoy the range. Shooting at the DPS facility would have almost been worth the four days of class by itself.

Aim small, miss small

[KaiserB]

For those attending, if the instructors/presenters indicate that something is new, please share it here. We'd all appreciate it.

...

...

With L-1 doing the prints and all the forms filled out online, the only service that could happen at the class would be passport photos. They are looking into having the L-1 picture also count as the passport photo but it’s not happening yet. The L-1 gear costs $14k I believe so having a gun range or individual teacher purchasing one isn’t really an option. L-1 is looking for partners to open up locations but only in areas that aren’t covered very well such as small towns. If applicants live out in the boonies, they are out of luck and will simply have to drive the hundred or so miles to a location. L-1 and DPS realize this is a problem but so far it has no solution. Paper print cards will not be accepted for any reason.

...

My recollection on the L-1 gear was $17K to buy the equipment and $1500 per year in software/hardware maintenance. L-1 has developed a "dear instructor" letter that should be sent out by the state soon.

Instructors will have "Instructor" on there CHL card when they renew or change address next.

TX DPS NO longer provides any type of printed form. All instructors and students must download forms and print their own if they want any type of "paper" application etc. This includes the CHL-16

[Chrispy]

Hi All! I got back to Houston Friday afternoon but due to a three day swim meet have finally been able to sit down and collect my thoughts about the class last week. Here are a few random ones.

- I was extremely impressed with all of the DPS staff that put this course on. The staff was very welcoming and friendly from the beginning to the end. Not what I expected. The peace officers that teach the class really buy into CHL as a whole. They have a true passion for it. They are not just teaching it because they have to. Thank goodness.

- The subject matter was pretty dry most of the time but they did their best to help us get through it. Each of the instructors had a great sense of humor and played some great videos for us to get us back from break and wake us up a little.

- For people taking future classes (probably starting this summer) they are probably going to be doing the classroom portion in three days instead of four. It would be three long days, probably 8am to 9pm with a lunch and evening break for grub then the range portion on the fourth day. The idea behind this is that it would help most people save a night in a hotel and a day off of work. Most out-of-towners just spend the evenings stuck with nothing to do in the hotel anyway so it kind of makes sense.

- You guys are right about the "what if" and common sense questions. There were a lot of them and you could tell that patience was wearing thin with a lot of students when they were asked. I am generally more patient then most. It didn't bother me all that much but I did include a suggestion about it on the eval.

- I learned a lot but something that stands out that I hadn't thought about before was mentioned by the legal group. It was about about not being able to carry where any school function is taking place. Of course I knew the school part or at an athletic event, but I had never thought about a field trip. The scenario that she gave was going to Kroger then you see that a school field trip is there. That's a violation of the law so you better go put it in the car or go to a different grocery store. It's something to think about.

- The range was a nice experience although a little nerve racking. Having the turning targets and having to start from the ready position makes it a little more difficult. Of course I passed with both guns but didn't leave a nice group in the center like I do on a normal day at the range.

- Now time to start prepping for my first class. No date set yet. Still trying to figure out the where and the when but looking forward to it.

Chris

[sjfcontrol]

- I learned a lot but something that stands out that I hadn't thought about before was mentioned by the legal group. It was about about not being able to carry where any school function is taking place. Of course I knew the school part or at an athletic event, but I had never thought about a field trip. The scenario that she gave was going to Kroger then you see that a school field trip is there. That's a violation of the law so you better go put it in the car or go to a different grocery store. It's something to think about.

Charles has made the argument that the school activity prohibition would apply to school grounds only.
See here for the relevant discussion: viewtopic.php?f=7&t=38722&hilit=school+activity#p462625" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
You should be aware that the DPS Legal department has it's own agenda.

[texasjeep44]

If the lady from the legal team thinks if a group of school kids comes in Kroger you're in violation of the law, well, I really won't post what I think about her.

It would be interesting for her to explain how she gets that out of any statutes that are on the books for Texas. In section 46.035 that definately would not meet the criteria for interscholastic event.

(2) on the premises where a high school, collegiate, or professional
sporting event or interscholastic event is taking place, unless
the license holder is a participant in the event and a handgun is used
in the event;

If she is refering to the section in 46.03, I think she is stretching her interpretation of the law as well.

(1) on the physical premises of a school or educational institution,
any grounds or building on which an activity sponsored by a school or
educational institution is being conducted, or a passenger transportation
vehicle of a school or educational institution, whether the school or
educational institution is public or private, unless pursuant to written
regulations or written authorization of the institution;

I don't think that the field trip to the local Kroger meets the definition of school sponsored event. If the school district rents out a convetion center for a science fair or graduation or something, that would definately be a school sponsored event. The fact they take a field trip to a local grocery store doesn't mean they are sponsoring my shopping event. Her interpretation would mean that if your a your local Cracker Barrel, (pick your other favorite restuarant), and a school bus stops there to let the kids eat on their way to a ball game or whatever, the restaurant immediately becomes a prohibited place simply by the presence of school children eating at the same restuarant on the way to or from a game.

I don't read the law that way. Maybe someone with a more valid basis can correct me and give us something to contradict my view, and support the lady from the state.