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So, first ticket I've gotten with my CHL. I was cited for having an inspection that was 7 days expired. Again, pulled over for having my front plate in the windshield. Shows me the officer is having a real slow day and is on a witch hunt. Officer is a FTO with his trainee onboard. Irritating issue number 1, pulled over by a COMPLETELY unmarked vehicle. Most police departments made it mandatory that their traffic units be marked because of several people who were pulling people over in unmarked crown vics and taking personal info, one most specifically where there were two people operating a DWI checkpoint near 1431 and IH 35, approximately a mile from where I was cited. Lets get past the fact that Round Rock finds they need to jeopardize their own patrol officers more than they already are. Officer pulls me to the shoulder on 35 just south of the 1431 exit heading NB, and proceeds to turn off all front lights on the vehicle, at which point I notice, no little red light in the front windshield. Now, at this point I should point out I work IT for a city in proximity of Austin, and I provide a lot of assistance to our local police department, which includes servicing their MDT's and their DVR systems. I am also very familiar with a lot of these procedures from talking with the officers during lunch and while working on their terminals. The FTO (Field Training Officer) is not recording this stop, or his equipment is malfunctioning, big flag to me. He also took 10 minutes plus to run my DL, my CHL, and also had my employee badge from the city I work for. I'm pretty sure, but someone correct me if I'm wrong, that RRPD has some sort of CAD system where they can run DL's from the MDT to prevent excessive detaining of people on traffic stops. The other thing that bugged me to no end was that the officer requested from me three times my social security number. For those that aren't familiar, you are not required to give an officer your SSN unless you are operating a motor vehicle with a CDL. Even under those circumstances, I can't speak for a certainty that you are required to provide it. All in all, I would say the officer in question, Watts, badge 3878, was professional and curteous during our engagement.

Due to several of the red flags that were raised, I went in today to speak to someone at the PD about this incident. I was definitely irritated with A) the complete unmarked (no black on black decals, no PD affiliation labeling, civilian plates, etc.), B) no DVR, c) the long return on my DL call-in, and D) the repeated request for my SSN. I walked in to the PD and what luck, a lieutenant (Lt. Bill Dixon) was in the lobby talking with a gentleman before me. I spoke very shortly with him and he came off as very rude and short. I pointed out my concern that his FTO was operating in a complete unmarked vehicle with no city affiliation and repeatedly asked me for my SSN when there was NO reason to since I do not possess a CDL, and he told me to learn my laws. I told him I am aware of most of these laws, but he kept it short until he disappeared into the bullpen.

At this point, I thank God I don't pay tax dollars to Williamson County or city of Round Rock.

I've had my Miata for about 6 years with no front plate (in DFW), never a ticket... the only cop who even MENTIONED it was a friend of mine.

3 days after I moved to Austin, I got a warning for no front plate in Round Rock on my way home from a job interview. The officer was professional (motorcycle cop, out of character from the rest of the ones I've met ) but seemed a little new and unsure of himself.

I'm going to try to avoid RR from now on if I can help it, at least when I'm in that car.

What's a witch hunt again? Maybe front LP laws don't apply to those with cool cars. Who knows.

PvilleStang wrote:So, first ticket I've gotten with my CHL. I was cited for having an inspection that was 7 days expired. Again, pulled over for having my front plate in the windshield. Shows me the officer is having a real slow day and is on a witch hunt. Officer is a FTO with his trainee onboard. Irritating issue number 1, pulled over by a COMPLETELY unmarked vehicle. Most police departments made it mandatory that their traffic units be marked because of several people who were pulling people over in unmarked crown vics and taking personal info, one most specifically where there were two people operating a DWI checkpoint near 1431 and IH 35, approximately a mile from where I was cited. Lets get past the fact that Round Rock finds they need to jeopardize their own patrol officers more than they already are. Officer pulls me to the shoulder on 35 just south of the 1431 exit heading NB, and proceeds to turn off all front lights on the vehicle, at which point I notice, no little red light in the front windshield. Now, at this point I should point out I work IT for a city in proximity of Austin, and I provide a lot of assistance to our local police department, which includes servicing their MDT's and their DVR systems. I am also very familiar with a lot of these procedures from talking with the officers during lunch and while working on their terminals. The FTO (Field Training Officer) is not recording this stop, or his equipment is malfunctioning, big flag to me. He also took 10 minutes plus to run my DL, my CHL, and also had my employee badge from the city I work for. I'm pretty sure, but someone correct me if I'm wrong, that RRPD has some sort of CAD system where they can run DL's from the MDT to prevent excessive detaining of people on traffic stops. The other thing that bugged me to no end was that the officer requested from me three times my social security number. For those that aren't familiar, you are not required to give an officer your SSN unless you are operating a motor vehicle with a CDL. Even under those circumstances, I can't speak for a certainty that you are required to provide it. All in all, I would say the officer in question, Watts, badge 3878, was professional and curteous during our engagement.

Due to several of the red flags that were raised, I went in today to speak to someone at the PD about this incident. I was definitely irritated with A) the complete unmarked (no black on black decals, no PD affiliation labeling, civilian plates, etc.), B) no DVR, c) the long return on my DL call-in, and D) the repeated request for my SSN. I walked in to the PD and what luck, a lieutenant (Lt. Bill Dixon) was in the lobby talking with a gentleman before me. I spoke very shortly with him and he came off as very rude and short. I pointed out my concern that his FTO was operating in a complete unmarked vehicle with no city affiliation and repeatedly asked me for my SSN when there was NO reason to since I do not possess a CDL, and he told me to learn my laws. I told him I am aware of most of these laws, but he kept it short until he disappeared into the bullpen.

At this point, I thank God I don't pay tax dollars to Williamson County or city of Round Rock.

I won't comment ob display of FLP, but whta's up with the SSN request. Did you give it to him? I don't think I would do that unless someone can cite a statute that requires it I will not comply with sush a request. I thisk I wouldhave asked the LT to cite the law for me since he's the expert. After all it's to Protect and SERVE! Right?

puma guy wrote:I won't comment ob display of FLP, but whta's up with the SSN request. Did you give it to him? I don't think I would do that unless someone can cite a statute that requires it I will not comply with sush a request. I thisk I wouldhave asked the LT to cite the law for me since he's the expert. After all it's to Protect and SERVE! Right?

As we all know there is no law that requires a person to give their SS Number to an LEO during a traffic stop. Maybe he was trying to find out if he was an illegal alien.

WildBill wrote:

puma guy wrote:I won't comment ob display of FLP, but whta's up with the SSN request. Did you give it to him? I don't think I would do that unless someone can cite a statute that requires it I will not comply with sush a request. I thisk I wouldhave asked the LT to cite the law for me since he's the expert. After all it's to Protect and SERVE! Right?

As we all know there is no law that requires a person to give their SS Number to an LEO during a traffic stop. Maybe he was trying to find out if he was an illegal alien.

Funny! Maybe Austin police chief is hoping RRPD will arrest all the illegal aliens so they don't have to.

I think someone in an unmarked vehicle might have trouble pulling me over .

glbedd53 wrote:I think someone in an unmarked vehicle might have trouble pulling me over .

Agreed. I'll slow down and move to the right lane... as I place my call to 911 asking them to confirm they have a real police officer attempting to pull me over.

PvilleStang wrote:For those that aren't familiar, you are not required to give an officer your SSN unless you are operating a motor vehicle with a CDL. Even under those circumstances, I can't speak for a certainty that you are required to provide it.

As a curent holder of a Class A TX CDL and a former truck driver I can comment. Under no circumstances are you ever required to provide your SSN regardless of whether you have a CDL or not. They can ask, but you are not obligated to provide it. You are only required to provide your DL and, if they are DOT certified (local LEOs are not in most states), your log book, medical card, bills of lading, and to prove that your emergency books are within arms reach of the driver's seat.

Sounds sketchy. I would not have given him my SSN.

RRPD...

RottenApple wrote:

PvilleStang wrote:For those that aren't familiar, you are not required to give an officer your SSN unless you are operating a motor vehicle with a CDL. Even under those circumstances, I can't speak for a certainty that you are required to provide it.

As a curent holder of a Class A TX CDL and a former truck driver I can comment. Under no circumstances are you ever required to provide your SSN regardless of whether you have a CDL or not. They can ask, but you are not obligated to provide it. You are only required to provide your DL and, if they are DOT certified (local LEOs are not in most states), your log book, medical card, bills of lading, and to prove that your emergency books are within arms reach of the driver's seat.

Absolutely Correct Sir, a lot of Drivers miss "HRG" must be within reach.
We also have to provide Cab Card (registration), Insurance,
plus "Hazmat card" (current annual training from Employer) if your load is hazardous.

AND of course,,,, CHL.

Thomas wrote:

glbedd53 wrote:I think someone in an unmarked vehicle might have trouble pulling me over .

Agreed. I'll slow down and move to the right lane... as I place my call to 911 asking them to confirm they have a real police officer attempting to pull me over.

And I'll take the ride in bracelets before I give them my SSN.
Let them explain their reasoning to the judge.
I know I can count on you nice folks for bail... right?

2up1down wrote: Absolutely Correct Sir, a lot of Drivers miss "HRG" must be within reach.
We also have to provide Cab Card (registration), Insurance,
plus "Hazmat card" (current annual training from Employer) if your load is hazardous.

AND of course,,,, CHL.

Whoops! Forgot about the permits and such. That's what comes from being outta the rig for the last 4 years.

Social Security # ? Thats insane, what on earth would they need that for? They gona run your credit? No way id give it to 'em. Id tell him no and ask for a lawyer if he kept badgering me. Ive herd about dps doin this in Arizona too. I wonder whats goin on ?

smtimelevi wrote:Social Security # ? Thats insane, what on earth would they need that for? They gona run your credit? No way id give it to 'em. Id tell him no and ask for a lawyer if he kept badgering me. Ive herd about dps doin this in Arizona too. I wonder whats goin on ?

Just a quick reminder that Texas and Arizona may have different laws. The feds have allowed states to require SSN for dl's, and I do not know if that applies to during a traffic stop or not. I do know Texas laws do not require it, but I am not sure I would extend that to Arizona. I would also probably refuse to provide it there, but I recognize it may mean a trip to jail when I do.