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by fm2
Wed Oct 14, 2009 8:12 am
Forum: General Texas CHL Discussion
Topic: To Chamber or not to Chamber?
Replies: 180
Views: 22615

Re: To Chamber or not to Chamber?

ScottDLS wrote:Everybody seems to be talking about semi-auto's. If you're really concerned you could carry a revolver with the hammer down on an empty chamber. Still could fire with one pull of the trigger vs. awkwardness of racking the slide on a semi-auto. Modern revolvers have firing pin blocking bars and floating pins, just like the semi-autos. Personally I trust these mechanisms on chambered revolvers and SA's. But if you're really worried, carry a revolver on an empty chamber. You'll have 4-5 shots at best, but you may get that critical first one off faster.
That's a good option. Revolvers become more viable with higher capacity models now available.
by fm2
Tue Oct 13, 2009 5:47 pm
Forum: General Texas CHL Discussion
Topic: To Chamber or not to Chamber?
Replies: 180
Views: 22615

Re: To Chamber or not to Chamber?

SlowDave wrote:The manual timing was someone with a stopwatch yelling "go" and hitting the start button and then hitting the stop button when the first shot was fired. Not a perfect measurement by any means, and I was drawing from a holster. As I recall, it was my OWB (outside waistband... dangit, now I have to spell it out ;-) ) holster. So results could be different with an IWB (inside ...) holster, but no way is it gonna be the 3-5 seconds that some have called out.
Did you try this with a cover garment?
SlowDave wrote: Appreciate the explanation of the club thing, but I think it is more typically someone just overstating things in an attempt to emphasize their point. I think that destroys your credibility. To your point, one could say that "a weapon w/o one in the chamber makes a poor club" but you could not say that it is only as useful as a club for self defense reasons. Unless of course, you are referring to a club that fires lethal rounds after a <0.1 sec delay for racking the slide.
Me?

SlowDave wrote: p.s. If you still don't believe that someone can draw, rack the slide, and get off the first shot quickly, search back through for the youtube video of the guy drawing from an IWB holster under a t-shirt with amazing shooting. It's on here somewhere. But... he DID have both hands available. EDIT: here's one: youtube draw and rack... FAST!
He's quick, but I think that's part of what Bill was talking about. That's a different context than a spontanious criminal assault.
by fm2
Mon Oct 12, 2009 4:26 pm
Forum: General Texas CHL Discussion
Topic: To Chamber or not to Chamber?
Replies: 180
Views: 22615

Re: To Chamber or not to Chamber?

SlowDave wrote: I've had this discussion before, and I hate the overstatement that invariably occurs. I will agree that carrying one in the chamber gives quicker response time and is a major advantage if you get involved and don't have both hands available. However, I tried to go draw and shoot both ways (starting with one in the chamber, then without one in the chamber) and with manual timing stuff, I could not measure the difference. It was less than 0.1 sec..
What carry method were you using? Speed, while important, is only one part of the drawstroke. You might want/need to use your off hand for something other than grabbing your slide.
SlowDave wrote: I understand the "carry chambered" crowd's position, just don't feel it's best for me, so far. And there is some additional risk in that method of carry, and not admitting it doesn't change that. I agree that if you follow the 4 rules, and draw and keep your finger off the trigger throughout, and don't make mistakes, there is no chance for the loaded (chamber included) gun to go off. But if you do everything right, no one would ever get shot on accident, so people make mistakes. Not having one in the chamber makes a whole nother level of effort that has to be accomplished before the gun will fire, either accidentally or on purpose. I'm taking that path. One day it might cost me my life, or save it. My choice. Feel free to make your own. [Flame suit on.]
I feel like this is a training issue and or a gear issue. Usually after people have taken a defensive pistol class, they build up the confidence and skill to be comfortable with carrying chambered firearm. The issue in the self defense, SD, problem as you noted, is time. Time to get your hand on the pistol, time to get the pistol up and ready to use. That becomes readily apparent in an interaction with a role player in real time drill or scenario. And then you don't have the unknown of WHEN something might happen that may occur in the real world.
SlowDave wrote: An gun with a full magazine and but nothing in the chamber is nothing more than a poor club. Really? Really? Wow.
The reason that people say this is that if you strike someone with the handgun it can damage the handgun. Sometimes a tap rack will get it up and running, but sometimes they are damaged to the extent that it will need to go to a gunsmith to get it operational again. I've hear of revolvers getting ejector rods bent or cylinders bound up after striking a hard surface.
SlowDave wrote: p.p.s. What's a FOF class? Please spell out any acronyms less often used than "USA". Thanks.
FOF = Force on force...... Usually scenarios or drills where you practice what you've learned against a role playing bad guy(s) aka: bg. Sometimes that means only training gun on training gun, somtimes it involves empty hands, training knives, and training guns.
by fm2
Thu Dec 20, 2007 10:56 pm
Forum: General Texas CHL Discussion
Topic: To Chamber or not to Chamber?
Replies: 180
Views: 22615

Re: To Chamber or not to Chamber?

Kitty, check you PM box.

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