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by VMI77
Tue May 06, 2014 10:59 am
Forum: LEO Contacts & Bloopers
Topic: Not a Good LEO Encounter
Replies: 118
Views: 29173

Re: Not a Good LEO Encounter

srothstein wrote:
VMI77 wrote:Not rare at all....I'm referring to the very frequent cases where the police report or claim one thing, up to arresting and falsifying charges on someone they abused, and a video they didn't know about surfaces and proves that they were lying (or some other evidence comes out or gets leaked). Seems like some incident like this comes out about once a week.
All of what you posted does happen, but the above quote is an important part of the problem. Remember that for something to be newsworthy, it must be rare, different, AND unusual. The old saw about a dog biting a man not being news but a man biting a dog is news.

Consider how many cases one officer in a big city makes. In San Antonio, I averaged probably around 15 calls per day. Lower it to just the arrests for a more reasonable number. I averaged arrests around once per day. Multiply it by the number of officers on the department on patrol. For San Antonio, I estimate it was about 700 back then. 700 arrests per day times seven days per week = 4900 arrests per week. One incident per week like you describe is still a rare event, percentage wise. And remember, the news will report it from anywhere in the states, not just the one city. It is even rarer than the one out of 4900.

I agree that even one out of 700 is way too many. But, Jbarn is correct that the police in general do a very good job. There are a lot of problems in law enforcement these days, and their image is very tarnished. There are even more problems with government in general. There are times I am very embarrassed to have ever been associated with law enforcement. But I know, deep down in my heart and academically in my brain, that most of the cops are doing a great job under difficult circumstances and that these incidents are very rare. And I know we still need to do more to eliminate them completely if we can.
I agree that you've put such violations of trust in a better context than I did, though I think comparing publicized incidents to total arrests probably understates the magnitude of the problem. Given human nature, and the fact that the opportunity to wield power over others is provided by law enforcement, lots of bullies and psychopaths are going to want to be cops. Most of them are probably weeded out in the hiring process, but some are bound to get through. My guess would be that the percentage of bad apples would be in the 1% to 5% range, varying due to a number of factors such as location, rigor of hiring practices, agency, required qualifications, and the attitude of command. At the low end that would give a member of the public about a 1 in 100 chance of having a bad encounter with law enforcement.

There is no way these kinds of incidents can be eliminated as it is a system populated and run by human beings. They can be minimized by various measures, but the most important measure is appropriate punishment for violation of the law and of the public trust.
by VMI77
Thu May 01, 2014 2:05 pm
Forum: LEO Contacts & Bloopers
Topic: Not a Good LEO Encounter
Replies: 118
Views: 29173

Re: Not a Good LEO Encounter

jbarn wrote:
VMI77 wrote:
gigag04 wrote:Shocked that someone who claims to have been mistreated by the cops lied about the affair.

Looking back on the thread, I'm not shocked at the number of people that ripped the LEO....



Bonjour...[/quote

And the way law enforcement at all levels is headed in this country, you shouldn't be.
You are referring to very rare incidents. Overall, LE performs outstandingly...
Not rare at all....I'm referring to the very frequent cases where the police report or claim one thing, up to arresting and falsifying charges on someone they abused, and a video they didn't know about surfaces and proves that they were lying (or some other evidence comes out or gets leaked). Seems like some incident like this comes out about once a week. Sometimes more than one officer is involved which makes it even worse. Sometimes the lying extends all the way to the top, including prosecutors. Often no action is taken against the perjuring officer.

It makes me wonder what was going on before just about everyone had a cell phone with a camera. Added to this are the numerous incidents where police try to prevent people from videoing them or even confiscate cell phones --for which there is rarely any reason but to hide what they are doing. I've also had some personal knowledge of police lying. Added to that are the cute little terms police use like "testilying." Also, I've been in jury pools where the prosecutor tells prospective jurors outright that the police lie on the witness stand and not to give an officer more credibility than anyone else.....but to examine the logic and consistency of their testimony. So, over the years I've gone from presumptively believing the police, to not believing either party, to presumptively believing the citizen (when said citizen doesn't have a police record).
by VMI77
Thu May 01, 2014 11:52 am
Forum: LEO Contacts & Bloopers
Topic: Not a Good LEO Encounter
Replies: 118
Views: 29173

Re: Not a Good LEO Encounter

[quote="gigag04"]Shocked that someone who claims to have been mistreated by the cops lied about the affair.

Looking back on the thread, I'm not shocked at the number of people that ripped the LEO....


Bonjour...[/quote

And the way law enforcement at all levels is headed in this country, you shouldn't be.
by VMI77
Thu May 01, 2014 11:38 am
Forum: LEO Contacts & Bloopers
Topic: Not a Good LEO Encounter
Replies: 118
Views: 29173

Re: Not a Good LEO Encounter

If the incident is as described, it's true highway robbery under the color of law.

Edited to add:

Should have read the entire thread first. Actually sounds like he got off easy.

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