dac1842 wrote:I have posted my thoughts on this subject before and some did not like what I had to say. Doubt you will like it now either. As a former LEO, I have no issues with a police officer asking for my weapon during a stop.
That is your prerogative...and I respect your decision. However, do not require that of the rest of us.
He has to put his safety first, He does not know you, yes you have a CHL and have gone through the background checks. But that does not mean you have not had a really bad day and are not going to flip out. Everyone thought Bundy was a nice neighbor until they found bodies in his freezer.
Sadly, I fear this is (or has been) taught in Academy's all across the nation. Officer safety is now "the only thing that matters". I certainly want officer's to be REASONABLY safe while doing their jobs. But I draw the line when officer safety trumps my Civil Rights, Jeopardizes MY safety, causes me unnecessary inconvenience, etc...
If we are to apply your logic (HIS SAFETY
FIRST), then it only makes sense to immediately disarm anyone on the scene (passengers, onlookers, other), call for backup, cuff the person stopped and hold them at gunpoint. I mean...what the heck, no need in taking any chances.
Yes, police work can be dangerous, (more for some than others). But, if you have reached a point in your career that you genuinely feel that a CHL (just having a bad day) poses a significant threat, then I submit it is time to find another occupation.
An officer has the right to disarm. If you read the law, the word reasonable is vague and any officer could reasonably argue, you were armed and therefore he felt for his personal safety he needed to disarm you.
The word reasonable is NOT vague, and I will gladly let a judge or jury make that point... if an officer wants to get especially "hinky" about it.
The times I have been stopped I have always told the officer before I handed him my chl that I am an ex cop, and I am armed and I OFFER to let him disarm me. So far none have done so, and I get stopped lots since part of my current job has me sitting in dark alleys watching other people work.
I am glad that has been your experience...and I hope it continues.
Just be cause you have a CHL does not mean you get any special treatment.
I agree. But...I hope you understand...this should cover both ends of the spectrum. My CHL warrants NEITHER a
favorable position or an
unfavorable position (fair enough right)?
It tells the officer you probably are on the up and up, but it also tells him you have a gun. On the street, someone else with a gun is not always a good thing.
Nor is it necessarily a bad thing. Unless you are suggesting that the mere presence of a gun makes all situations inherently dangerous, is that what you are implying?
You should expect to get disarmed if you get stopped.
Theres the problem.
But try this, in the future as you hand him your CHL be proactive, before hand you are a CHL holder, you are armed and offer to let him disarm you.
I am surprised to see you suggest this...since apparently you do not feel the law abiding, legally armed citizen really has any say in the matter. Besides, how would the officer know you weren't "having a bad day" and were trying to get the drop on him? Come on folks....CHL's are not the bad guys.
Odds are he wont. Why? officers make a living reading people and situations, if you are offering all the above before you hand him the CHL and offer to be disarmed he will feel a lot more comfortable with you and you being armed.
I did not get my CHL with the idea that I would need to "sooth, secure, or stroke" the officer's feelings...in hopes that he/she will relax and NOT disarm me. I am always, courteous and accommodating to LEO when stopped, and with one exception... have always enjoyed the reciprocal. Some folks have not been as fortunate, and I am beginning to understand why.