TexasCHLforum.com

ghostrider wrote:I've read this thread repeatedly and I'd like to summarize:

Its great that we live in a country where we have the freedom to carry and make choices, and we can even have this conversation. :-)

boomerang wrote:Good morning!

for Shiner Commemorator

Now I'm off to have a couple of eggs and some coffee while carrying a handgun.

Oldgringo wrote:

03Lightningrocks wrote:Talk about tempting fate. .

Please tell me that your finger is not on the trigger and you didn't intend to shoot that little kitty?

mr.72 wrote:

Count wrote:I believe you when you say you have a family history of alcoholism. I believe you when you admit you're impaired after one drink. However, that doesn't mean everybody has a family history of alcoholism, nor the same reaction to alcohol.

I don't think the people who can drink responsibly are the ones in denial.

I think everyone is impaired after one drink, or more precisely, I think everyone is equally as impaired after one drink if it is the first day in their life that they try a drink, or if they have been heavy drinkers for 20 years. I don't believe that over time you gain a tolerance to the impairing effects of alcohol. I think that over time you simply are desensitized towards your awareness of your degree of impairment.

I never suggested that everyone has a history of alcoholism, and this is where you are making a logical fallacy. I suggested that even though I have a family history of alcohol, including the experience of being around heavy drinkers most of my life, I still contend that those who drink without thinking they are impaired are deluded or in denial. This comes from a great amount of personal experience observing people who drink. I can always tell if someone in my family has had at least one drink, even if they claim that they are not impaired after only having one drink.

And yes, I do think that anyone who thinks they can drink and not be impaired is in denial. However I think that some people (including myself) can drink responsibly. Drinking responsibly includes being aware that you are impaired, and making certain that you do not endanger others as a result of your drinking. So if you think going out and drinking "a few beers" will not result in any impairment, then you are indeed in denial and you are absolutely not drinking "responsibly".

gregthehand wrote:[quote="WildBill"Your experience with hunters is contrary to what I have observed.

gregthehand wrote:You know I've seen investigation of shootings where the shooter had been drinking. While it was touched on it was not as big a deal as some of you guys think it would be. If it's a good shoot there is no reason for them to get your waitress and make her testify. Some people on here really over analyze how the legal system works and I honestly think walk around with the feeling that they can get in trouble at the drop of a hat. While yes you can I just don't want to go through life afraid of everything (like having a beer an hour before I had to use my wepaon). Some people will call me careless but I'm not. I just don't want to live in fear of every little thing that some big mean DA can do to me. The argument of two beers with dinner to me sounds way too much like the other stupid arguments I hear. Will hollow points get me in trouble? What about a trigger job? How about my night sights and laser? If someone is attacking you and you are fear of you or someone elses life that's it. I'll worry about that all of that stuff later.

Sorry I know I will get flamed and I'm probably not going to respond to this thread again. Not because I find it annoying but just because I think we are going back and forth about the same stuff. If you don't want to drink at all and carry fine. If you think two or one drinks is ok then fine to that too. I think we can all agree that being drunk with a gun on your hip isn't too smart. Aren't we just all saying that same thing over and over again here guys?

mr.72 wrote:This thread is still going?

I have found that people will come up with a variety of creative justifications and rationalizing to support their drinking habits. My family has a long history of alcoholism. I drink fewer than 4 drinks per year and have made a deliberate effort to ensure it doesn't ever become a habit. I am 5'11 and 195 lb from a family of heavy drinkers, and I can tell you that I feel impaired after only one beer. My personal belief is that people who claim not to be impaired or to not recognize any impairment after x number of drinks are simply desensitized to the sensation of impairment. Of course you will never convince a drinker to consider this kind of argument, because like I said, people will engage every order of denial and rationalizing in order to defend their drinking habits.

The libertarian in me loathes the 51% law and the drunk driving laws as well. They are examples of laws that have sacrificed our liberty in favor of an illusion of safety, and the drunk driving law is used to allow all kinds of abridgments of our freedoms by the police.

boomerang wrote:

Totally Frustrated wrote:All,
I'm gonna keep out of this other than to make this statement.
In a shooting trial, it sure will look bad to a jury when a restaurant full of witnesses testify they saw you drinking prior to the incident. The Prosecutor would love it though.

I drink with friends but I don't go to bars because of the 51% nonsense but you make a good point. The witnesses have no idea if you're drinking a non-alcoholic beer or a real beer. They don't know if you're drinking a Diet Coke with lime or a Cuba libre. If strangers see you drinking anything at a bar or restaurant, I bet some would testify you were drinking before the incident, even if your BAC is 0.000000000000000000000000000000%

WildBill wrote:

03Lightningrocks wrote:Something to ponder. I have hunted for years....like 45 of them...LOL. I have hunted in many places with many different hunters. I have never known a hunter to say he would have a beer or drink just before going out to hunt. Drinking while hunting is nothing short of stupid. You could shoot a cow, your hunting buddies or even yourself. This policy has never been don't get "drunk" while hunting. It is an all or none policy. If I were hunting with you and saw you swilling a brewski while sitting in the stand, i would leave, just after beating you down like your momma should have done...LOL.

WildBill wrote:Your experience with hunters is contrary to what I have observed.

03Lightningrocks wrote:That saddens me. A few bad examples make us all look bad. I know they are out there but I would like to believe most act responsibly. So is your point that you think hunters should go ahead and have a few brewskis in the deer stand? Keep searching and you will discover that we are not all beer swilling rednecks.

I am glad that you have had positive experiences hunting. Of course my point is not that hunters should go ahead and drink from the deer stand. And I don't think that all hunters are beer swilling rednecks.

I taught hunter safety classes for many years and most of my students were not rednecks, beer swilling or no. Every year the instructors would have a meeting with the Game Warden in charge of the Department of Fish and Game Hunter Safety program and he would go over the safety records from the previous year. Most years there were very few reported accidents where someone actually was shot. As I recall, 3-5 per year was the average. That is a pretty low number considering the number of people hunting.

I was never much of a hunter and I have not hunted for many years, but I have always had a policy of no alcohol when handling guns. I also picked my shooting partners with care. If there was any evidence of drinking I would leave and never go out shooting with them again.

WildBill wrote:

03Lightningrocks wrote:Something to ponder. I have hunted for years....like 45 of them...LOL. I have hunted in many places with many different hunters. I have never known a hunter to say he would have a beer or drink just before going out to hunt. Drinking while hunting is nothing short of stupid. You could shoot a cow, your hunting buddies or even yourself. This policy has never been don't get "drunk" while hunting. It is an all or none policy. If I were hunting with you and saw you swilling a brewski while sitting in the stand, i would leave, just after beating you down like your momma should have done...LOL.

So here we are in a CHL forum discussing drinking while carrying. Interesting contrast to me. Maybe it is because some CHLers first exposure to firearms was reading cool magazines and interweb stuff. Fellers....i wish I could tell you how many times I have watched a guy claim he can handle his booze and end up looking like a fool.

Your experience with hunters is contrary to what I have observed.

Oldgringo wrote: I have found, over the years, that ordering a drink/beer with a meal when eating out is an expense I don't need. The added benefit is that I don't have to concern myself with possible conflicts between my CHL, my DL and/or the LEO.

KRM45 wrote:
You'll get no argument from me on that. It has been many years since I had even a drop of alcohol.

KRM45 wrote:

03Lightningrocks wrote:To each his own but if I am going to have a drink...even one, i don't carry. My concern is not so much for getting drunk as it is for having to use my handgun and then getting accused of being drunk.

This is where the logic fails for me. If I am in a position where I "have to use my handgun" and I left it at home that means I or one of my friends/family is likely to not survive the encounter. I am not willing to allow that over some fear that I might be arrested for PWI (Packing While Intoxicated)...

Armybrat wrote:Since the post about my visit to Pat O'Brien's (San Antonio) on the 1911 and Ruger boards undoubtedly inspired this thread, I'll reiterate:
I don't consider having one drink with my restaurant dinner once in a while as "going out and drinking". Apparently some of the teetotalers equate that with pub-crawling or fratboy binge drinking - which I NEVER do. I know what the law says, and it does not say "no drinking at all when carrying"....or driving, for that matter. (I wasn't driving in my case).

My original concern was the placement of the 51% sign at that Pat O'Brien's.


But hey, beat up on me all you like.