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flechero wrote: ↑Sun Oct 06, 2019 11:36 am I agree with you. 9mm is a good round, but I think .45acp is a better round.

My only complaint, if you want to call it that, is that so few people these days [on the 9mm side] can/will admit that there is a difference.


In the words of the Rob Leatham - While 9mm may be entirely adequate, it is not equivalent [to .45acp] so don't kid yourselves.

I compensate by carrying 135 grain +P ammo, trying to close the gap a bit that exists between 9mm and .45 ACP—even if it still isn’t a match.

narcissist wrote: ↑Sun Oct 06, 2019 11:50 am

abom2 wrote: ↑Tue Oct 01, 2019 6:35 pm I will stick with what I know works for me. Of course I am pigheaded. I joined the Marines when it was not cool, only stupid people who could not hold a Real Job in the World joined.

Carried the 1911 for more than a decade before the transition to the Beretta. Unit I was in kept all of the Beretta's in the armory after six months of fooling with them. Used our Unit's Special Training Funds to acquire a "Modern pistol" chambered in .45 ACP for each line person in the unit. Carried those in DS and again in 2004 in Al Anbar province.

School of Hard Knocks degree is what I follow. It works for me, others can do what works for them. After all that is why we can choose between mustard or ketchup, or both.

You brought up the 1911, im sure by the time you used it all the kinks were worked out. My Father also my Uncle said in Vietnam the 1911s were inaccurate and malfunctioned a lot. Any Vietnam Vets on here remember this and if so maybe if you dont mind telling us you're experience with the weapons. Also in nam, they had the M1 Garand then changed to the M-16 near the middle of the war. Which weapon did you prefer? Sorry off subject but....

In Vietnam, they switched from the M14 to the M16, not from the M1 Garand to the M16. The M14 entered service in 1959. It was replaced by the M16 in 1968. The M14 was similar to (but not exactly like) the M1 Garand, but it had different furniture, an external removable box magazine, different gas-piston, different caliber (.308/7.62 NATO as opposed to .30-'06), a roller bearing added to the right-side bolt lug, a different operating rod, different sights front and rear, the addition if a flashhider, and let’s not forget the all important select fire lever with a setting for "full boogaloo". But yeah, other than those minor differences, it was "the same rifle".

I used to carry .45 ACP, in either of several different 1911 variations, or in both double and single stack polymer pistols. I’ve also carried a .40 for a while. I sold the .40 because I don’t like the characteristics of the recoil impulse. But eventually I stopped carrying a .45 and switched to 9mm Glocks, and I did that for a very specific reason....my wife carries and shoots Glock 9mm pistols, and it was important to me that she should be able to pick up my gun and use it if she had to. She is not really a gun person, and she has no interest in learning to shoot other calibers and/or pistols; and I’ve been married to her long enough to know not to push my luck trying to push her into it.

So I now carry Glock 9mms. I agree that a .45 hits a bit harder, but 9mm has been killing people even longer than .45 ACP. Shot placement does count, but it’s not the only factor; and at least one of the variables is how determined the bad guy is to press the attack. It’s worth noting that Amber Guyger, who was convicted of murdering Botham Jean just a few days ago, fired 2 rounds.... only one of which hit the victim. That bullet hit him in the upper chest at a downward angle, went down through through his chest, passing through some major blood vessels and his lung, penetrated his diaphragm into his abdomen, holing both his stomach and his intestines. That’s impressive penetration. I believe that DPD issues 9mm Sigs to their officers, and that the individual officer may substitute .357 Sig if they want, but they have to pay for the gun themselves. If someone has more current info than that, please correct me. In any case, unless Guyger bought herself a .357 Sig and carried it, it LOOKS like she shot Jean with a 9mm, and killed him with one shot. That one shot penetrated deeply and put him out of commission VERY quickly.

I’m not naive enough to believe that all 9mm hits result in 1 shot kills ... but the same could be said for .45 ACP, or even the mighty .357 Magnum. I’ll grant that those two are more powerful and hit harder than a 9mm........BUT.....the 9mm hits hard enough. I don’t feel particularly under-armed with a 9mm, and at least my wife can shoot it and isn’t intimidated by it. I don’t think I’m likely to need all 15 rounds in the mag that’s in the gun, but it holds that many, so I might as well carry them. And I always have at least one spare mag with me, because 2 is 1 and 1 is none.