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extremist wrote:

superstar wrote:

apostate wrote: I completely missed how a dress code equates to "pseudo-ATF governing powers" and, to be honest, I'm still missing the connection.

I also disagree with the conclusion that OWB is inherently much faster than IWB, given comparable cover garments or lack thereof. However, I'm willing to look at the data with an open mind if you can share it.

What data? lol it's just logic. Most OWB that I have seen wear their shirts tucked in as opposed to IWB, are you telling me that lifting your shirt and or moving the jacket/sweater to retrieve your pistol in IWB is much faster than OWB? kudos to you if you are related to the flash.

If you read through the posts the pseudo-ATF governing powers was mentioned because it is the same range/store that are asking for the NFA stamps.

We are not carrying concealed at the store - just IWB. Negligible difference in accessing handgun in that instance.

You seem to be comparing OWB OPEN CARRY to IWB CONCEALED CARRY for your logic. Which is not logical :)

And I apologize for taking this thread off the original topic. Perhaps we can start another thread discussing the merits of open carrying OWB vs IWB???

As someone who regularly carries OWB both with and without a cover garment, this was confusing to me as well. A cover garment will definitely slow your draw, marginally (less than a second). I have seen this myself in IDPA competitions where we sometimes forego the cover garment requirement in the summer. But I can't see how their would be any difference between IWB and OWB.

I'm not sure why, but some people tend to think that OWB always equals OC and IWB always equals CC. The reality is that there is very little correlation there IMHO.

Abraham wrote:extremist,

Kudos to you!

I can see the point of the IWB requirement. That is an employee dress code / uniform issue. Personally, as a customer, I am more comforted if all of the employees are wearing guns I can see (as opposed to concealed carry), but I really don't care if they are IWB or OWB. If I wanted to standardize as an employer, I would probably buy identical, leather holsters and then issue those to my employees as part of their uniform. Just like a shirt with the company logo, etc. I would make them all OWB holsters just to avoid causing any back issues for my folks. Maybe even put a concho on there with the company logo.

I also understand that newer shooters can be intimidated by walking into a range the first time. But from my experience as a newer shooter years ago, and with taking new shooters to the range on average once every 2-3 months or so, this is usually more a function of the employees attitude than what they are wearing. Some range employees can feel like you are talking to a LEO who has just stopped you for a traffic violation. This is one reason why I like the range where I am a member (Boyert). They are just "country club" enough to relax newer shooters without going all out and having Latte's and massage stations. If the concern is with not scaring off newer shooters, then train your employees to be friendlier. And if an employees wants to go Rambo with camo paint and a bandolier of .50 cal ammo, that can be addressed with a 1:1 conversation from their manager as opposed to a one size fits all dress code. That employee would probably also be violating the "be friendly" rule, so the conversation should be about more than just what they are wearing.

The Annoyed Man wrote:

extremist wrote:

The Annoyed Man wrote:

azwe wrote:Is there a requirement for you to bring your original tax stamp to the range when shooting a suppressor, SBR, or other NFA item? Today is the second time I've been told by a friend that they were turned away from a range because they only had a copy of their paperwork. My gun range has never asked me for the tax stamp or even a copy of it. I have copies in my range bag and one on my phone. Original is in the safe tucked away for safe keeping.

Obviously their range = their rules. I get it. But am I missing something? One range said that you could go to jail if you didn't have the original tax stamp in your possession at the range.

Must be a new trend. Just yesterday, I went to Shoot Point Blank in North Richland Hills for the first time, to try out my new pistol suppressor. At the register before entering the range, they asked me if I needed to rent any guns, and I said, no I brought my own and was just there to try out a new suppressor. Nobody cared.

Later, while at my shooting lane, the RSO came over to me, and asked me if this was my first time there, to which I said yes. Then he said, “do you have a stamp for that thing?” I said yes, and he asked me to produce it. I was shocked.....nobody has ever done that to me before, but I had paid for my hour of shooting, and wanted to get back at it without getting into an argument by telling him to go pound sand. So I got the copy out of my case and showed it to him, he thanked me, and I went back to shooting.

A couple of lanes over, there were two guys shooting several handguns and a 9mm SBR - all suppressed. One of them was apparently a Glock employee, which I discovered as we chatted briefly. After the RSO left, the Glock guy came over to me and asked incredulously, “did he just ask you to show your stamp?” When I said yes, he asked “what the heck for?” I said it beat the crap out of me, but that I complied so that I could get it over with and get back to shooting. He said, “that’s bovine manure!” To which I agreed. Nobody had asked him to produce his stamps.

On Monday, I will be sending an email to their management.

Chris, that is the policy at ShootPointBlank, it's in the range rules that you signed when you bought the waiver. I was teaching the LTC class last night but saw Dave T. come in with his Glock Gen5 shirt on and said hey. Didn't know he was shooting any NFA items. I would have said Hi if I would have seen you also. But the RSO should have asked him too, even though it may have annoyed him. But it's really not a big deal (at least to me) I always carry my Form 4 copies with me for the items I have. Go ahead and write to managment - they won't change it. Just the policy set by Tom the owner in Ohio. Just like the requirement that we as employees have to carry IWB, no OWB carry. I don't like it either, but if I want to work there, I live with it.

I think our range is pretty cool, RSOs are generally not annoying - I know I'm not when I'm on duty Clean, big and well lit.

James

Well, his property, his rules, but he has no more logical reason to demand to see a stamp than he has to demand that the shooter prove he is lawfully in possession of the guns he brought with him. That is the proper purview of law enforcement, and nobody else.

I won’t be back.

They should probably check the license and registration for the vehicle you drive there to make sure it is legal. And if you bring your kids maybe they can require you to produce a birth certificate along with your ID just to make sure that you really are their parent and didn't kidnap the child.

This sounds like a range owner who wants to play LEO.