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mojo84 wrote: Glad you have it all figured out. How does your family member's staff of attorneys stack up to Wal-Mart's?

You are welcome to contact TABC and set them straight. After all, they are the one that can pull your family member's permit if he violates their rules.

anomie wrote:
I think he's trying to point out that what TABC stated and what the law actually says may be two different things.

Consider the following situation:

Someone carries into a Wal-Mart, concealed, without a CHL/LTC. Nobody at Wal-Mart sees or knows about it. The person who did this then brags about it on, say, Facebook, and someone at TABC sees it.

If the law actually were "TABC is required to begin permit/license cancellation proceedings if it is discovered an unlicensed handgun was brought onto the premises of a licensed/permitted business", then in the above situation, TABC would have to start permit/license proceedings against the Wal-Mart - because a) someone without a CHL/LTC carried onto the premises and b) that this happened was discovered.

With the law quoted saying 'knowingly', then Wal-Mart has to allow it while knowing both that a) the firearm was carried onto the premises and b) that the person carrying doesn't have a CHL/LTC, and in the above situation Wal-Mart knew neither (a) nor (b).

I think that's why metal detectors were mentioned, if they're on the hook for a cancellation proceeding just because it happened and was discovered, then they would reduce their risk of getting their license cancelled by trying to actively ensure no guns were carried into the store without a CHL/LTC.

Or, for a TL;DR: I think the TABC response may be asserting more than the law actually says.

mojo84 wrote:
Nice try. Why would they need metal detectors for openly carried guns? The fact you said they would need metal detectors specifically implies concealed carry of handguns..

mojo84 wrote:
The entire premise of my question to them was based upon open carry. If one is open carrying, it stands to reason they will know. You are the only one that has tried to construe this to include concealed carry.

Context matters and we are talking in the context of open carry.

mojo84 wrote:

Solaris wrote:

mojo84 wrote:For those of you that think it is a copout, excuse or up to the TABC agent's attitude or mood, here is the response to my direct email inquiry to TABC. I hope you find this post edifying.

Hello Mojo84,
 
Under Sections 11.61(e) and 61.71(f) of the Alcoholic Beverage Code, TABC is required to begin permit/license cancellation proceedings if it is discovered an unlicensed handgun was brought onto the premises of a licensed/permitted business. This being the case, retailers should make arrangements to verify the License to Carry of anyone who possesses a handgun on their premises. Ultimately, how each business chooses to fulfil this requirement is up to them, but TABC is required by law to begin cancellation proceedings if a violation is found.

Notice it says they are required to begin permit/license cancellation proceedings if it is discovered and unlicensed handgun was brought into the premises.

No it does not say that. Here is what it says:


11.61(e) Except as provided by Subsection (f) or (i), the commission or administrator shall cancel an original or renewal permit if it is found, after notice and hearing, that the permittee knowingly allowed a person to possess a firearm in a building on the licensed premises.

61.7(f) Except as provided by Subsection (g) or (j), the commission or administrator shall cancel an original or renewal dealer's on-premises or off-premises license if it is found, after notice and hearing, that the licensee knowingly allowed a person to possess a firearm in a building on the licensed premises.

Huge difference between knowingly allowing something and not.

Can you expound upon your post as I am having trouble getting your point?

mojo84 wrote:For those of you that think it is a copout, excuse or up to the TABC agent's attitude or mood, here is the response to my direct email inquiry to TABC. I hope you find this post edifying.

Hello Mojo84,
 
Under Sections 11.61(e) and 61.71(f) of the Alcoholic Beverage Code, TABC is required to begin permit/license cancellation proceedings if it is discovered an unlicensed handgun was brought onto the premises of a licensed/permitted business. This being the case, retailers should make arrangements to verify the License to Carry of anyone who possesses a handgun on their premises. Ultimately, how each business chooses to fulfil this requirement is up to them, but TABC is required by law to begin cancellation proceedings if a violation is found.

Notice it says they are required to begin permit/license cancellation proceedings if it is discovered and unlicensed handgun was brought into the premises.