TexasCHLforum.com

RiverCity.45 wrote:

cheezit wrote:leaning nither left or right and being from cali. i can assure you there are plenty of libs that are pro 2a.

It's very comforting to lump all "liberals" into the anti-gun group, but that is just a convenient shorthand fantasy that has no basis in fact. There are anti-gun liberals and there are pro-2A liberals. There is an entire forum devoted to those 2A supporting progressives. I know, I know. Some people's heads will explode just trying to grasp that reality. LOL!

Seriously, though. Just as all conservatives are not the same (e.g., recent Support by some Republicans for gun control), there are some liberals who staunchly support the 2nd A.

Alright, well let me ask some questions. Do these pro-2A progressives believe that I should be able to own an AR-15 and as many 30 round magazines as I want to without registering it, etc? And do they believe that I should be able to sell it to whom I see fit to sell it to without jumping through paperwork hoops and paying money to the Federal government and to an FFL to complete said transaction? And do they further believe that I shouldn't be vilified and called every filthy name in the book because some person with mental issues, or some criminal, commits a crime with a similar weapon? I ask these questions because I do indeed have trouble believing that the answers would be affirmative without qualifying all of said answers with some sort of rhetoric. My personal opinion, of course.

nitrogen wrote:Changing minds goes both ways.

Personally i think both liberals and conservatives have a lot to learn from each other. If you want them to listen to you, you should listen to them. You might change for the better, too.

I've been listening to liberal-progressives my whole life of 42 years on this earth...every day through the news, television, movies, music and other mass media. I believe I have an idea of what they are about by now. No personal offense intended in the least, just my opinion.

VMI77 wrote:

anygunanywhere wrote:

cheezit wrote:leaning nither left or right and being from cali. i can assure you there are plenty of libs that are pro 2a.

Sorry. The only time this makes sense is if the word liberal is used in the original definition.

The current liberal is defined as a progressive. The progressive mentality is that of collectivismn and socialism/marxism.

A person cannot call themselves a liberal and at the same time be pro 2A. They are not mutually inclusive.

Also, if an individual claims to be both, at what point along the progressive agenda continuum will they either:

1. Give up their 2A RKBA so they can remain in the good graces of the progressive socialist crowd.

or

2. Realize the error of their ways and hold true to the 2A and the rest of the constitution and BOR and abandon the progressive agenda?

I grow weary of these current crop of liberals trying to project a false facade of being pro 2A while at the the same time voting and supporting those who are intent on disarming me.

Anygunanywhere

Exactly. A liberal who supports the RKBA is like a Christian who doesn't believe in Jesus. People seem to be confused over the liberal label these days. I find that many people who lean towards libertarian social values and have little else in common with progressives often call themselves "liberals." Very few of these "liberals" satisfy the litmus test of modern liberalism: being a collectivist. You can be all over the place politically if you're not a collectivist, but if you're a collectivist you're an ideologue committed to a single course of action.

I agree with you that the labels that people may be attaching to themselves don't necessarily fit the things that they actually believe in nor the labels as they are used by the press or public in general. Its really hard to tell the players without a roster...

While I wish to keep things as civil as I can, I also do not intend to be "nice" to collectivists by "agreeing" that they are "reasonable" regarding firearms; they are not. They want to limit our rights as free American citizens, and as Texans, too. I will state this as clearly as I can: I have not harmed anyone with my firearms nor done anything else to warrant being treated as a criminal or potential criminal. I do not intend to use my firearms against another human being unless it is necessary in the defense of my family, myself, or perhaps my property, depending on the property in question and the situation. I do not agree with any of these new "gun control" laws being proposed, nor the POTUS' list of executive orders. I don't care if they are "watching me" in that regard. If I make them unhappy with my viewpoint, so be it.