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AJSully421 wrote:

TexasCajun wrote:

AJSully421 wrote: I just don't see the OC thing being too much of a problem. Best chances are that if you walk in to any grocery store or shop in town that either no one will notice, they will assume you are a cop or security (If you are dressed decently), or worst case, you will be approached by a manager and asked to leave because you are OCing. Go out to your car, toss on your concealment rig, and go right back in.

Finally, we may have hit on something that is worthy of a more detailed discussion! If you are OCing and are asked to leave, would that verbal notice prevent you from being able to return with a concealed firearm?

That is a good point of discussion that you have brought up. My stance would be that it would all depend on the words used in the verbal notice. If the manager said "We do not allow guns in here." I could see that covering both OC and CC. Now, if they said "We do not allow open carry of firearms", I would step out to the truck and grab my concealment holster and walk right back in.

Even if they said "no guns"... you could ask specifically, "So you are saying that you prohibit only the open carry of firearms?" they will not know the nuance of the law and reply "that's right", and that would give you the cover to go out and conceal. Then, should it go to court, it becomes a "Well, it is true that I said X but what I really meant was Y". After all, you would walk right back in without a pistol visible on your hip... how would they know that you did not leave it out in your vehicle? Only way that they would know is if you have to use it. The chances of that in most cases are insanely low. And if you have to use your pistol... then you have bigger problems than did a verbal notice satisfy the requirements of 30.07 and not 30.06.

AJSully421 wrote: I just don't see the OC thing being too much of a problem. Best chances are that if you walk in to any grocery store or shop in town that either no one will notice, they will assume you are a cop or security (If you are dressed decently), or worst case, you will be approached by a manager and asked to leave because you are OCing. Go out to your car, toss on your concealment rig, and go right back in.

Ruark wrote:

Texas1999 wrote:To stop and detain you and require you to produce a license, the LEO first would need reasonable suspicion to believe you do NOT have a license to OC. They cannot just randomly stop you and demand to see a license, just as LEO cannot randomly stop a vehicle to "check and see" if the driver has a driver's license.

I keep hearing both sides of this concept. If you're fishing or hunting, a game warden can stop you at any time and check for your fishing/hunting license and a photo ID, as well as registration for your boat, inspect it for safety equipment, etc. all without any suspicion. Is that the same thing? But I'm really leery of this when OC is concerned. Some yahoo cop will want to see my CHL, then want to see my ID, and maybe he'll want me to disarm while he does it ("for my own safety...."), then he'll start lecturing me about how my gun is cocked-and-locked, or whatever. Then 10 minutes later I run into another cop and go through it all over again.

joe817 wrote:Good grief! Am I the only person here who has had encounters with LEO's when producing my DL & CHL??? You all are making it WAY to difficult, in a non-issue situation!

BEFORE you reach for your wallet, tell him up front where your wallet is and ask him how he wants to proceed. That de-escalates the situation before it even develops. There's nothing to be nervous about......unless you REALLY have something to be nervous about!

txcharvel wrote:

Abraham wrote:Carry your wallet on the opposite side of your gun.

Easy.

What if he doesn't want to carry his wallet on the opposite side? I don't think this will be that big a deal, but the situation could happen. I would just let the officer know where my ID is before I reach for it.

RetNavy wrote:this just popped in my head this morning..... I am right handed, i carry on my right side..... wallet is in the back right pocket..... open carrying.... stopped by a LEO and asked for ID.... reach back with right hand to get wallet.... LEO sees hand going towards weapon... ??????

ScottDLS wrote:

A-R wrote:

Jaguar wrote:The way I see it, cops can request ID from anyone but usually that person doesn't have to provide it (see PC section 38.02). However, if you are carrying openly they can still demand your ID, and now you have to show it or you will be in violation of 411.205. Can't beat that rap or ride.

IANAL

Fixed it for ya

Except there's no "ride" for 411.205 violation unless they chose to take you in for 46.02 after not producing (C)HL. Interestingly, since your "(C)HL" is not ID, 411.205 directs you to produce both. What if you prove you're licensed by producing non-ID (C)HL, but refuse to produce ID/DL?

Jimbo_47 wrote:If and when it passes I look for a lot of calls for MWG and the LEO's have to respond. There are a lot of people that don't keep up with what goes on. It will be interesting watching what happens!

Texas1999 wrote:How will LEO know whether a person OC'ing is in fact licensed?

The act of OC'ing, absent any other circumstances, would not give LEOs reasonable suspicion to detain you and investigate whether you have a CHL. This has been an issue in other states, where someone OC'ing is illegally detained and asked to ID himself to make sure he has a license, and/or is not a felon prohibited from possessing a firearm. Such detentions are illegal and unconstitutional, but it doesn't seem to stop LEOs from doing it and harassing law-abiding citizens.

Imagine if you were driving down the road, breaking no laws, and a cop arbitrarily stopped you "just to check and see of you have a valid driver's license." That's an unconstitutional stop.

I foresee this being an issue if "licensed" OC passes.

Thoughts?