TexasCHLforum.com

NguyenVanDon wrote:

Charles L. Cotton wrote:As TX stated, robbery is a combination of two other crimes. A shorthand version is robbery is theft plus assault.

Chas.

Same scenerio on the first page:

It's 2pm. Outside the grocery store. The guy runs and Tackles me on the floor, takes my wallet, got up, and started running.

Am allowed to shoot him?

Nothing really has changed, it's still just robbery, not ag robbery. Plus the fight is over, he's running away.

If I see three males approaching me at night at a gas station (I say gas station b/c I don't stop at rest stops) and it looks like they may be up to no good I won't pull my gun just by looking at them. How about this? Just yell STOP. Extend that south paw out there and make the universal open hand sign for stop. NOW if they continue to advance I would feel threatened enough to present my weapon. Make sure you say stop when they are far enough away that three more steps outside of stop they will still be past 21 ft. Loud verbal commands are an important tool in a shooting. You want to make everyone around you a good witness as to why you HAD to shoot. They should be able to say that there were three guys walking toward you after you yelled stop loudly and told them not to advance. They should then be able to say that even after you presented a firearm and said stop they continued to advance. To them you shooting should be obviously a last ditch option. If you just pull a gun it's going to be your word againist three others. Not very good odds, especially if they say they were just going to ask for a ride, or money, or or. Also what if they really were? At night do you really think you can make out the facial chareteristics of a person that looks threatening, from a distance? I think your CHL instructor may have been a little too gung-ho about when you can shoot and when you can't. Maybe just to say when you should shoot, or even present your weapon, and when you shouldn't. If you have never pointed a weapon at somebody it is a horrific experience, shooting them is a 100 times worse. You need to make dang sure that before you do either you KNOW the law, not only what is written, but also how it is applied. I can think of something right now that is a really bad situation if you just pull your weapon with out verbalizing yourself as feeling threatened. Lets say I'M at a gas station, and I have actually just been acosted. Let's say someone stole my wallet and ran off. Now I'm not going to pull my gun and shoot them, and I don't run fast so lets say they got away. Lets say for some reason I am unable to make a phone call (cell phone is dead, no signal, it got taken too, etc) so I see a nice enough looking guy pumping gas. I look threatening because, hey I'm irritated my wallet just got stolen, I can't find a pay phone, and I'm broke now that my wallet is gone anyway. I just want to walk over and from a so-so (a car length or so, since not everyone is going to keep a 25 ft safe distance) safe distance ask if they could call the police I have just been robbed. Instead when I'm about 30 ft away you just pull a gun on me, and glare at me. No stop or anything just whip it out. Well hey I just got robbed maybe this is a follow up, or trap or something. Maybe they wanted to get me off guard and now here comes the real whammy. Sure at our desks we can think rationally, but on the street in the middle of the night, our reactions will be quicker, less rational (often), and often have to be made quickly. Best case scenario is a stand down, worst case someone get shot. Verbalize your actions. If someone yells stop most people will stop. "When in doubt whip it out" is not a good policy concerning your firearm.

I think this is no more about right and wrong rather then legally justified or not. If you are that concerned about your wallet you need to get the kind you hang around your neck, or that chains to your belt. You should also carry as little cash as possible, and stay alert to your surroundings. You should also keep a piece of paper with any account info for cards, with the number to the institution locked up in a safe at home. This way you can cancel the cards without looking for the numbers. Taking a life, ANY life, should not be done over something like a wallet. I can't think of a thing I own that is worth the $50 mentioned earlier, let alone half that. I also can't think of anything anyone rich I know owns that is worth a life. People get sued for shooting someone who was in their home with a gun to hurt and rob them. Do you really think this guy you just killed's family is not going to sue you for wrongful death? If you have some zealot DA, or Investigator they will come after you, and you will have to hire one hell of an attorney in order not to go to jail. Point it I can think of a thousand different reasons to shoot someone running away with my wallet, but I can't think of one that trumps the reasoning of it just being just plain old WRONG. For those who think it's right, well next time you lose your wallet, I sure hope you don't open fire on the person responsible...

Remember you can only use deadly force to protect property that can not be replaced. I can tell you that most any prosecter, and a lot of grand jurys are not going to side with you on shooting the guy. Think about it this way. On average the legal defense, costs of lost time at work etc, amount to an average of $50,000.00 everytime you pull the trigger. Do you keep that much in you wallet?